Special Aircraft Service
Individual Mods and Packs for IL-2 1946 => Skins, Maps, Missions & Campaigns => MapWorx (Common) => Topic started by: agracier on May 18, 2010, 04:44:17 PM
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There is often a tendency to try and get as much land area onto a map as possible. That's also why some maps are at scales different from the standard 50m= 1pixel or 1/1. Some maps are at 100m= 1 pixel or 1/2 and so on.
I don't know why, but I never thought of trying out the opposite - making a map much larger to scale. At 200% size for instance, that being 25m= 1pixel or 2/1.
To see how it would look on an area that has previously looked so awful in a regular sized map, I thought I'd see what part of Catalonia and the Pyrenees would look like in this scale. I've always had a weak spot for this area and tried making several maps back when i first learned how to make maps, but somehow or other the terrain looked very off putting, the mountains especially looking artificial and very unrealistic.
Now however at 200% size, the terrain looks very different. So I'm wondering if it's me or if others would also think so.
Here is a link to a very very basic map at 2/1 scale. It has only one texture, and I made no efforts at an FMB map either ... this is just a test map to see how the height and terrain appear on this unusual scale ...
If it works out, it might be interesting to make some more detailed maps of smaller areas ... while still retaining large maps overall ...
Here's a download link.
https://www.mediafire.com/?yfzmyd2mzdq (https://www.mediafire.com/?yfzmyd2mzdq)
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Flied this map in I-16 type 6 :)
OK in HSFX4.1.
Mountains look much better now.
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Ag, initially I liked your idea and for the Grozny area would be good but now I have second thoughts.
Maybe it's not a good idea to use it for my map project.
25m per pixel means distances are twice as far, right?
I don't think it'd be a good idea to fly a map like that, IMO. It might look good just to joy fly around, but for me, I would want distances to be realistic, for historical missions. And I suspect most others would want the same.
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Tell me this doesn't look like a nicely proportioned hilly/mountainous landscape ... these are from a map of northern Spain, Catalonia made at 30m = 1 pixel, or around 175% size or thereabouts ...
I really like the feel and look of the landscape and will see about working this one out a bit more ... besides, another SCW map can never do any harm ...
(http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq302/agracier/Catalonia-200520100-13-13.jpg)
(http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq302/agracier/Catalonia-200520100-13-50.jpg)
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Now that looks nice.
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Yeah, it does....i'll test it out a bit later today... ;)
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Yeah, it does....i'll test it out a bit later today... ;)
The screenshots are from another version than of the map linked above ... the screenshots show some texturing with different slots assigned different textures, so it's a bit less one dimensional ...
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Ag, initially I liked your idea and for the Grozny area would be good but now I have second thoughts.
Maybe it's not a good idea to use it for my map project.
25m per pixel means distances are twice as far, right?
I don't think it'd be a good idea to fly a map like that, IMO. It might look good just to joy fly around, but for me, I would want distances to be realistic, for historical missions. And I suspect most others would want the same.
Hi Agracier!
The screens of the hills/mountains you post are really natural , I hope to test your map linked above this evening to reply better after first person test!
Too I am curious about a reply at CzechTexan post quoted above!
cheers
walter
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Changed the download link from the first post. This is also a basic map, but with 7 or 8 textures assigned provisionally to map_t ...
https://www.mediafire.com/?yfzmyd2mzdq (https://www.mediafire.com/?yfzmyd2mzdq)
It's only in a basic stage, but this map should give a good idea of terrain and landscape ... there are no cultivated fields yet, which are often very important in getting the appropriate look and feel, but that's a more complicated task and will be for later on ...
I think it shows promise. This map used 1 pixel = 30m in the Microdem 'change map area' command.
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I downloaded version 1 and 2 and both seems to have a corrupted ed_m01.
Anyway, even without a ed_m01 maps won't load. In FMB it says "Stand by" and "Loading Map" but nothing happens. I gave it a try again after converting your 3MB .tga's to 1MB .tga's but no joy...
Edit: I copied the ed_m02 and renamed is as ed_m01 and used the 3mb .tga's and now it loads. :)
In my opinion it looks better as if the mountains have more elevations and seems to be more curved. I don't know how to explain in a clear way so here are some screenies from the second download and make your own opinion. ;)
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh195/Uufflakke/1e3521e1.jpg)
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh195/Uufflakke/ad5ae1a4.jpg)
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh195/Uufflakke/7e52cc41.jpg)
(http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh195/Uufflakke/d4b75475.jpg)
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Wow! Those mountains look great.! ???
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Wow! Those mountains look great.! ???
And they are aren't even properly textured either ... apparently the shots above are of the highest parts of the map as they are the ones with 'snow' textures ... when you go down lower the proportions of height and width ad curvature and all those solid geometrical terms, look even better ...
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Hi mate!
I also downloaded version and have a corrupted ed_m01!
As the byte difference between them is great , doubling the ed_m02 is a good solution or I should wait for an update?
cheers
walter
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I also downloaded version and have a corrupted ed_m01!
As the byte difference between them is great , doubling the ed_m02 is a good solution or I should wait for an update?
Blistering barnacles ... my version works fine so maybe something happened when making the rar file or during upload?
Anyway, this is just a very basic version to show the proportions in the landscape regarding mountains ... I'll upload a newer version if you like, but if you can get it to work with the above solution, I'd say that's fine too ...
Just for fun I made some shots of areas with mountaintops i know quite well. And I have to say they are quite recognizable in the game - which surprises me ...
(http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq302/agracier/Catalonia-2005201018-21-23.jpg)
(http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq302/agracier/Catalonia-2005201018-23-02.jpg)
And 2 other general shots:
(http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq302/agracier/Catalonia-2005201018-16-19.jpg)
(http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq302/agracier/Catalonia-2005201018-20-46.jpg)
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Well mate!
I'll test it with the interim solution immediatly!
About the map scale: which scale you got with this solution?
cheers
walter
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About the map scale: which scale you got with this solution?
Well, I'm not a hot shot when it comes to math. But ...
..normally in Microdem with the 'adjust map area' command you choose 50m to equal 1 pixel. That is supposed to give a 1/1 or 100% scale for a map.
If you use 100m to 1 pixel then you get a 50% map or 1/2. This is often done to include a large area in the map, to make large maps for strategic maps.
For this map here, I used 30m to 1pixel, which is almost the same as a 200% map or 2/1 ... (I would have used 25m=1 pixel, but Microdem couldn't handle the memory requirements for the area I choose - so you fudge a bit ...)
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Aneto : The highest summit of (Pyrénées, French. Los Piréneos, Spanish), near the river Garonne, Garona and French border.
Which are the limits of this map?
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Aneto : The highest summit of (Pyrénées, French. Los Piréneos, Spanish), near the river Garonne, Garona and French border.
Which are the limits of this map?
That's right - though you can only see the Aneto as an outline on the horizon from this point on the map - just as in real life. And for the Middle Earth fans here, the Aneto is part of the Maladeta massif or les Monts Maudits (in French) which translates roughly as the Doomed Mountains or Mount Doom if you will ... anybody have a ring they want to get rid of? ... ha ha.
Anyway, the limits are approximately from Barbastro/Huesca in the west to the Mediterranean coast in the east, and north from the French border more or less down to just south of Tarragona. Barcelona is nicely off center in the map, but still at the heart of things. Caspe (on the Ebro) is still on the map, but the Ebro mouth is not.
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Hi Agracier,
I've downloaded the update :D Will have a look at this map this week end.
It does look very interesting.
At least your thinking off the normal plane of things ;)
I think it is a very interesting idea.
One area that I would like to see this idea used is in Northern Burma and China.
Do you still get the game height cut off point with this scaling?
I made a map of Northern Burma/China and it just looked horrible with very flat mountain tops.
Definitely a good idea to use with very mountanous regions. 8)
All the screen shots look great from you and others. ;D
Cheers Kirby
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Those are awesome pics Ag.
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One area that I would like to see this idea used is in Northern Burma and China.
Do you still get the game height cut off point with this scaling?
I made a map of Northern Burma/China and it just looked horrible with very flat mountain tops.
Definitely a good idea to use with very mountanous regions. 8)
I'm not sure about the cut off height, but I think it is inherent to Il-2 ... whatever the height is (6000m?) it will remain the same in any map I would think ... but I do remember there was a post once somewhere (AAA?) where it was explained that you could set a new base line for what Il-2 'thinks' is 0meters. For instance you choose 3000m as base line 0m and then you can make a decent looking map of areas in the world that are between 3000m and higher on up to 9000m.
There was once an Everest map posted like that - it was a 'for fun' map of course and it also suffered from mountains that looked squished together ... but it does work ...
And as for northern Burma and southern China - a lovely area to map for sure.
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Blistering barnacles!!! Hahah...one of my all-time favorite comic characters... ;D
(https://storebror.it.cx/sas/archive/sas2/Malone/PICS/CaptainHaddock.jpg)
8)
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Blistering barnacles!!! Hahah...one of my all-time favorite comic characters... ;D
The versions I read were with: 'duizend bommen en granaten ...' - you should be able to recognize that I bet ... not too different from Afrikaans ...
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That's right - though you can only see the Aneto as an outline on the horizon from this point on the map - just as in real life. And for the Middle Earth fans here, the Aneto is part of the Maladeta massif or les Monts Maudits (in French) which translates roughly as the Doomed Mountains or Mount Doom if you will ... anybody have a ring they want to get rid of? ... ha ha.
Anyway, the limits are approximately from Barbastro/Huesca in the west to the Mediterranean coast in the east, and north from the French border more or less down to just south of Tarragona. Barcelona is nicely off center in the map, but still at the heart of things. Caspe (on the Ebro) is still on the map, but the Ebro mouth is not.
Thanks for answer, so that map will represnt Cataluña. I've asked this question because I live in the other side of the border, in Toulouse precisely.
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Thanks for answer, so that map will represnt Cataluña. I've asked this question because I live in the other side of the border, in Toulouse precisely.
Well, a bit unfortunately I suppose, Toulouse won't be on this map as it's really a ways too far to the north. It won't even have Perpignan, just Andorra and places like Salses (with it's beautiful fort) and the French region that is called French Catalonia I believe. Even the villages and houses look more Spanish than French ...
Anyway, here is a preliminary FMB map to show the area. This is a map I'm really excited about because the landscape looks so much better than in usual 1/1 maps ... It will probably take some time to get it properly finished though. Everything, bar populating with objects should be finished in a week or so. But then comes the last 10% of the job that will take 90% of the time to get done ... placing objects and making cities and such.
To be realistic about finishing the map, I'd figure sometime in late autumn probably and even then I'm hoping to get someone aboard to help out with, for instance, making Barcelona or Tarragona ...
France, especially southern France, is still one of those regions that really should be done for Il-2. But it's densely populated in both senses of the word, and I've already so much on my plate that I don't dare take it on.
(http://i458.photobucket.com/albums/qq302/agracier/CataloniaFMBsmall.jpg)
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Hi agracier I downloaded your 200 scale map.
WOW ??? What a difference it makes.
It's a pity though in regards to the longer flying times.
At first had probs loading up the download from the second link.
I noticed ed_m01 was missing in the map folder.
I just scaled the ed_m02.tga up by two saved as ed_m01.tga and everything is sweet 8)
Awesome mountains!!
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Hi agracier I downloaded your 200 scale map.
WOW ??? What a difference it makes.
Awesome mountains!!
I think one of the first maps I ever made was one of the Pyrenees and it looked simply awful ... ha ha. The mountains were totally malformed for some reason, like a whipped cream layer on a cake or something. But in 200% they do look presentable.
I think I still need some work done on the mountains themselves, but so far I believe that every texture slot is in use ... maybe I´ll use a cultivated field texture or two less and assign them to mountain textures ...