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Author Topic: He-111 strafing?  (Read 4704 times)

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naki27

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He-111 strafing?
« on: November 12, 2011, 02:38:34 PM »

I recently watched the movie Patton.  (excellent movie btw)  Several scenes showed He-111 bombers strafing allied troops with their defensive guns.  Here's one:
Did real He-111's actually do that? and if so, is there a way to make AI bombers in Il-2 do the same?
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Docholiday

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2011, 02:41:51 PM »

Hey there was a version with up to six (6) forward firing 2cm canons.

They were used in russia for train-busting.  4 canons were fixed and two drainable.

Doc
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LuseKofte

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2011, 03:00:53 PM »

Yes  I read a special Flypastmagazine about Barbarossa They had a many siders of HE-111 and one pilot reported the plane was an awful strafer, he went in low at Battle of Kursk with Petrol in his Bombbay and dropped it at very low altitude. As a low level plane it was too wounerable, slow and absolutley not made for the task.
But German highcommand made theyr pilot do the most of theyre plane
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phaethon

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2011, 03:29:18 PM »

there were even reports about he-111's and ju 88's shooting up grounds forces during the battle for creete!
i imagine it wasn't the first time either...anyone handling a gun is itching to let fly a couple...after all!
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JG54Spookie

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2011, 10:47:27 PM »

I think I read somewhere that while attacking ships, nose gunners would use the 20mm nose cannon to "deter" AA gunners on board the ships.
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Phas3e

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2011, 10:57:28 PM »

I think it was pretty much, Have gun, will strafe.

I recall reading about Early RAF Bomber command raids where single Wellingtons and such used to do low runs over German airfields on their way back to England, the nose and tail gunners would fire at anything that presented itself.
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Slink

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2011, 02:09:03 AM »

"Search & Destroy", or more freely "Open Season".
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US_GRANT

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2011, 05:30:58 AM »

Isn't Jagd akin to jadger (Hunter?). Wouldn't that make it Free Hunt? All the same at the end of the day when you're ground crew is cleaning tree branches out of your wheel wells.
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Eexhaton

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2011, 05:55:46 AM »

I think I read somewhere that while attacking ships, nose gunners would use the 20mm nose cannon to "deter" AA gunners on board the ships.
This...

And ofcourse, on every opportunity that came to hand..
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Slink

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2011, 06:20:29 AM »

Jagen means to hunt or chase, so it's often called free hunt or free chase, which is far too literal, i.e, a transliteration.
In German fighters are Jager (hunters in one context, or pursuit in another a la early US terminology, which would be verfolgungsjagd)
or even Abfangjager (interceptors), but to translate the actual meaning into its English equivalent means finding the corresponding expression for the same concept (the same expression can be used for the same concept in two languages, sometimes word for word, and sometimes a completely different expression but which means the same thing, which leads to a lot of confusion and mistakes).
The concept of the fighter as a hunter is probably more apt and accurate, as all combat aircraft are indeed Kampfflugzeuge, another generic meaning fight, combat, struggle, that's how it works in German, conceptual generics. This is also one reason why Adlertag was originally very aptly and amusingly set for the Glorious 12th, the opening of the Grouse hunting season in England, and that's where "open season" comes in.
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razor1uk

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2011, 06:59:19 AM »

  While Free Hunt isn't an actual modern English expression, and so doesn't sound quite right, the meaning is easily understandable - thanks to the Angle & Saxon components, grammer etc within English; to varied extents, Danish, German, Friesian/Belge-Dutch & French translate very well to English than other languages.
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naki27

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Re: He-111 strafing?
« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2011, 07:22:25 AM »

Would the strafing really be effective?  In the movie only two He-111's wreaked havoc on the American base, using only their guns (except for the explosion at the beginning, which I'm assuming was a bomb).  Whenever I try this in Il-2, even with the level autopilot set, I barely damage anything.
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