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Author Topic: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map  (Read 6159 times)

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WxTech

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #36 on: April 30, 2022, 09:55:04 AM »

Yep, it's my lightning mod featured in that pic.
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WxTech

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #37 on: April 30, 2022, 09:58:53 AM »

Skimming the palm groves at Vila, lobbing shells into a hangar. You can see the faint glow on the interior walls from the lit up Betty I just hit. Click for the full size 2560x1440.

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WxTech

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #38 on: April 30, 2022, 10:29:45 AM »

More of an overview of Vila. The lower stretch of the Vila River has been added.

I tweaked my palm plantation object with an additional LOD (from 3 to 4), so as to retain visibility of the tree trunks to longer distances; they would become thin and hence disappear at fairly short range.

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stanislao

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #39 on: April 30, 2022, 11:53:37 AM »

I really appreciate the work you're doing on the map of New Georgia, but I have to point the finger
on your palm grove block that has some elements that should be improved, although I use it with pleasure, but in my opinion it would be necessary to solve and cancel the carpet effect that is produced when you put many of them together on a large surface, it creates unrealistic diagonal dark lines, and it would also be necessary to find a way to create at least one block with irregular border lines to soften the "green brick" effect... Perhaps thinning the palms and creating different heights within the same block....   ;)
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WxTech

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #40 on: May 01, 2022, 06:19:21 AM »

I've gone back to the palms. The two single palm tree objects have been redone. I've eliminated the 3D fronds, leaving just the simple polygons for the fronds. In addition to the two vertical double-sided panels (8 polygons total), I've added a third horizontal one. This means that the fronds now comprise only 12 polys per tree for the nearest LOD, and 10 polys for the other LODs (because at longer view distance it's unnecessary to see the underside of the horizontal panel.) The trunks have been left as they were in my previous treatment, although I did some tidying up. The total poly count per tree is now about 1/3 what it was previously, implying that 3X as many trees can potentially be drawn for a given frame rate value.

I used a spreadsheet to lay out a 6 by 6 grid of single trees, on N-S, E-W axes, by which to make a template. I applied a random departure in position of up to +/- 0.5 meter in both axes, so that the trunk bases don't look precisely lined up. And I applied a random rotation so that repeatable patterns should be minimized. Most of the trees are the taller one; one in six are the shorter tree.

This first pic is of that array of 36 trees.





Here we've walked up closer, to get a view from below. I prefer this simpler model, because the multi-poly fronds stood out as different to the overall effect.





As an experiment, I filled in a part of the field at Vila with a bunch of these 6x6 arrays, adding individual trees where necessary to fill in the triangular gaps. Compare with the surrounding palm plantation blocks that I've left in place for the moment. Note that there are no readily apparent patterns like the 'herringbone' seen in the palm plantation blocks.





Pulling back farther for more of an overview. Now to see if about similar coverage by these new trees over the whole field will not be too injurious to frame rates...

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genXgamer

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #41 on: May 01, 2022, 07:24:01 AM »

Hi WxTech

Can you please share the LOD numbers made for the palm plantation block so I can recommend players use them in my readme file.

Once finalized can you make available the 6 X 6 block, I would like to trial these around my Gurney Airstrip as soon as possible.
These will be used in high visibility areas around revetments and lining the runway.

Can you please provide a comparison poly count of the 40 X 40 and 6 X 6?   My plantation is of similar size to yours, so I need to be smart on how each is used.

Stanislao, varying height will only make patterns more obvious when repeated many times, the only way to eliminate patterns is to have everything exactly the same just like runway plates.
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stanislao

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #42 on: May 01, 2022, 09:19:34 AM »

 :( 
MMMM.. I realize one thing ..... from below and up close the palm blocks will be a real marvel, but from above it will not be possible to avoid the unpleasant striped or checkered fabric effect, the squared boundaries of the painting may perhaps be attenuated rotating the blocks and using groups of three or four palms here and there ...

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Stefano

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #43 on: May 01, 2022, 09:29:59 AM »

Wow รจ bellissima complimenti.
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WxTech

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #44 on: May 01, 2022, 09:35:40 AM »

Stanislao,
Search Google for images of coconut palm plantations taken from the air. The pattern of the rows of trees is most regular and pronounced. I'm doing the same here, with the trees in rows as they were planted by people. Remember, Vila airstrip was hacked out of the middle of just such a man-made plantation.

Otherwise it would be easy to randomly plunk down trees to make the more chaotic arrangement of nature.

By the way, if you look over the Slot maps you will see areas where the terrain texture has a regular, dotted pattern; this is to represent the numerous, and sometimes pretty extensive plantations that were set up throughout the Solomons.
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WxTech

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #45 on: May 01, 2022, 09:40:10 AM »

I forgot to mention that I've also been slimming down the trunks a bit. The stock models have the base of the trunk flaring out like bell-bottom jeans.  😀  The pics above have had a bit of this treatment, but I since did some more trimming.
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WxTech

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #46 on: May 01, 2022, 10:25:52 AM »

Hi WxTech

Can you please share the LOD numbers made for the palm plantation block so I can recommend players use them in my readme file.

Once finalized can you make available the 6 X 6 block, I would like to trial these around my Gurney Airstrip as soon as possible.
These will be used in high visibility areas around revetments and lining the runway.

Can you please provide a comparison poly count of the 40 X 40 and 6 X 6?   My plantation is of similar size to yours, so I need to be smart on how each is used.



The 40m square palm plantation object formerly had three LODs. I added another LOD between the hi and mid ones, making for four LODs. Not that they will do anyone any good until I release the updated model, but here they are:

60
275
1000
1500

===================================

The 40m square palm plantation object has the same number of polygons for all LODs, the count being 52.

My re-worked single palm tree, for its most detailed LOD, has 40 polygons. A 6 x 6 array of trees covers pretty much the same 40m square area, but has 36 * 40 = 1,440 polys, or almost 28X more than one of the 40m plantation blocks. You can see why I wanted to make a low-poly model that would efficiently cover ground at low cost in resources.

Now, there is an aspect of the single palm trees making them less onerous. As mentioned, the 40m plantation block has the same 52 polys even for the farthest LOD. By contrast, the single tree has 13 polys at the two farthest LODs (of the four present). And so at longer distances a 6 x 6 array of trees comprises 36 * 13 =  468 polys, or 9X more than making up a 40m block object. The ratio is getting a tad more agreeable.

===================================

Note that I'm not making a discrete single mesh containing 36 individual trees. That would be a bit of work when not having proper 3D modeling software. At this point, anyway, I'm simply making effectively a mission file whose contents in the relevant section looks like this:

Code: [Select]
[Buildings]
  0_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98000.3 90409.7 406
  1_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98008.4 90410 572
  2_bld House$FurniturePalmAs2 1 98015.5 90410.1 476
  3_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98023.8 90409.8 363
  4_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98032 90410.5 375
  5_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98040.3 90409.8 690
  6_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98000.2 90417.5 699
  7_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98007.9 90417.7 375
  8_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98015.8 90418.5 401
  9_bld House$FurniturePalmAs2 1 98024.3 90417.7 401
  10_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98031.7 90417.9 720
  11_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98039.8 90417.8 588
  12_bld House$FurniturePalmAs2 1 97999.8 90425.6 521
  13_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98008.1 90426 630
  14_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98016.2 90426.4 364
  15_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98023.8 90426.1 595
  16_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98031.9 90426.4 676
  17_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98040.3 90425.6 516
  18_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98000 90433.6 542
  19_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98008 90434.4 657
  20_bld House$FurniturePalmAs2 1 98015.9 90434.4 568
  21_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98024.1 90433.7 579
  22_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98032.3 90433.5 623
  23_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98040.3 90433.8 363
  24_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98000.2 90441.6 485
  25_bld House$FurniturePalmAs2 1 98007.6 90441.5 566
  26_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98015.7 90442.2 396
  27_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98024.2 90441.8 505
  28_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98031.9 90442.3 421
  29_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98040.2 90442.1 468
  30_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98000.1 90449.7 669
  31_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98008.2 90449.8 385
  32_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98016.3 90450.3 601
  33_bld House$FurniturePalmAs2 1 98024 90450.4 570
  34_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98032 90450.1 448
  35_bld House$FurniturePalmAs1 1 98039.5 90449.6 610

In each line here are a pair of numbers roughly equal to 98,000 and 90,000; these are the E-W and N-S coordinates, in meters, respectively, as measured from the SW corner of the map. One would plunk this block of text into a .mis file, then find the group, drag it or copy it, then paste wherever desired. For a tiny map, one could first subtract, say, 50,000 from these in order to ensure that the group does not fall outside the map edge. The last number is the rotation, apparently with 360 added.

Incidentally, in the experiment illustrated previously, there were 442 trees laid down. The polygon count at max would be 442 * 40 = 17,680 (you'd have to be about in the middle of the group to have all trees drawn at the highest LOD), and at min would be 442 * 13 = 5,746.

For further comparison, my previous single palm tree had 108 down to 27 polys, depending on the LOD. The old stock tree had 139 down to 19 polys.
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genXgamer

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Re: My treatment of agracier's New Georgia map
« Reply #47 on: May 01, 2022, 04:00:58 PM »

Thanks for the above information, it seems the best solution for populating large areas will always be the 40 x 40 block.

I did start a very low poly single palm tree mod that was put on the backburner, it was based on the same principal as the ugly card like trees.
I used the frond texture from the 3D model and a very straight truck.
Many of the palm trees used on maps are never seen up close and could easily be replaced with low poly ones and in far greater numbers.

On a side note, I have two ships doing evasive manoeuvres, the wake is angular when they turn.
Not that long ago you posted a screenshot with a ship turning and having a more rounded realistic wake.
You could see the immediate excitement this created, stanislao, Epervier and others all commented how good it looked.
Will this ever be introduced?
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