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Author Topic: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns  (Read 2643 times)

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andydd

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Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« on: October 26, 2015, 12:17:42 PM »

I have tried to search but havent found any answers. I have played Dcg campaigns like Battle of britain and stukas always crash each other in midair. Also dornier 17 sometimes do that.
Is it a formation promblem, something with dcg or with 4.12.2 patch? Can someone help me please
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sniperton

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2015, 03:10:19 PM »

If you have the "Massed Bombers" option checked in DCG, uncheck it. When your bomber flights are not crowded together in one single large formation they are less prone to collide on turns.
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andydd

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2015, 12:05:28 AM »

It doesn't affect stukas, it only affects medium bombers. I have done some testing and i think it must be somehow dcg fault because in fmb it doesnt happen. I use 2 flights in dcg.. Does anyone know the cure for this? And where can i Find dcg 3.48 if it would help
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andydd

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2015, 04:17:08 AM »

I quess theres no way to have good dynamic battle of britain campaign on il2.. Because without stukas its not the same. 2 out of 8 stukas get to the target. All others collide in formation.
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sniperton

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2015, 09:03:29 AM »

Dunno whether it would help, but DCG 3.48beta16 is available here (link in post #167): http://forum.jg1.org/topic/1433-dcg-348-open-beta-test/page-9

It's possibly an old AI bug: https://www.youtube.com/v/oB1X2FV2vv8
Recently discussed here: http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=229299&page=7
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andydd

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2015, 04:30:32 AM »

Now stukas work! I dont know if its the newer dcg or that I changed stukas default payload. Those are the things i did. Now stuka flights fly separately and dont collide each other. It was first plane from second flight that always rammed the 4th plane from the first
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sniperton

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2015, 05:57:13 AM »

Great! Just for curiosity, have you increased or decreased their payload?
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andydd

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2015, 06:07:27 AM »

I changed ju 87 level bombing weapons from one 500kg to 250kg and 4x50kg bombs. I really dont understand how that can change the formation they are flying but now they do. Maybe newer dcg changes something? I have done all the testing with dbw battle of britain 1.3 campaings channel battles part. Dcg also changed something that now some British squads start from france..
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sniperton

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2015, 10:43:31 AM »

At campaign startup DCG allocates all squads to airfields closest to the frontline. You can suppress this by checking the "No squadron transfer" option AND reallocating them one by one to other airfields via the Timetable.dcg file. The syntax is

Quote
  19420505 MoveSquad USA_BG_043z0 12_Miles_Airfield

As to the other issue, it may have something to do with pilot skill and engine management. You say it was always #5 who rammed #4. In DCG, #1 and #5 are the most experienced pilots, while #4 and #8 the least experienced ones. Both flights have to fly along the same flight path (same waypoints and schedule times), and it's up to the AI to keep a safe distance between flight A and flight B, that is, as it seems, between #1 and #5.

Now if the planes are overloaded, and/or are forced to climb too steeply, and/or you specify a cruise speed too high for them, #4 will not be able to keep up with #1, while #5 will be. Just a blind guess.

Anyway, I have had several similar problems in my campaigns, and it was my experience that most of them could be resolved by
1) reducing the cruise speed to 280-300 kph for fighters and to 240-260 kph for bombers (BoB and early Med-era);
2) reducing bomb load (particularly when you see AI bombers crash on takeoff);
3) reducing fuel quantity (in RL there was a trade-off between bomb load and fuel allowance; btw, on most Il2 maps, you don't need 100% fuel, not even for Bfs).
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andydd

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #9 on: October 28, 2015, 01:49:12 PM »

thank you sniperton, this helps alot! I keep on testing
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Lonestar67

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2015, 11:04:05 AM »

Large bomber formations are unfortunately one of the weak points of DCG!
This problem often occurs also, when you shoot down a certain bomber from the formation!
Thereafter the affected flight regroups and colliding later with other bomber of the entire formation!
I have tested this with selfmade missions and had not this problem!
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DCG And Third Party Campaign Installation Manual: http://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php?topic=20872.0

sniperton

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Re: Stukas crashing in dcg campaigns
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2015, 02:42:07 PM »

I have tested this with selfmade missions and had not this problem!

And what have you done differently? If you could point out that, it would be an important step towards a solution.

My guess is that the problem is originating in DCG creating one and the same flight path for all flights, that is, all flights are scheduled to fly through the same waypoints at the same altitude and at the same time. Perhaps the solution would be as simple as to make them have slightly different altitudes, say N meter for flight A, N+50 meter for flight B, etc, etc.
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