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Author Topic: Russians back in business  (Read 4288 times)

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352nd_Hoss

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Russians back in business
« on: June 21, 2013, 07:02:42 PM »

Something I read today on Boeing News,

Russian Air Power Makes a Splash at Paris Air Show

The Wall Street Journal    06/21/2013

Author: Daniel Michaels

(Copyright (c) 2010, Dow Jones & Company, Inc.)

 


LE BOURGET, France—At the Paris air show this week, one of the biggest attractions wasn't an airliner from Airbus or Boeing Co., but a Russian fighter jet.

The new Sukhoi Su-35 streaked across the sky here in flying displays, making its first appearance outside Russia and performing extreme maneuvers that few Western aircraft can achieve.

The plane carries new defense systems and missiles that—for the first time in years for a Russian aircraft—rival those made by Western suppliers.

"I think that this shows we are firmly holding a position as one of the world leaders," said Mikhail Pogosyan, chief executive of Sukhoi builder United Aircraft Corp., a holding company created in 2006 to consolidate and rebuild Russia's battered aviation industry.

Two decades after the collapse of the Soviet Union, Russia's defense industry, like the Su-35, is roaring into global markets. United Aircraft and its Russian peers are benefiting from years of restructuring under President Vladimir Putin, rising Russian military spending and more attention from Moscow.

Russian military exports have roughly quadrupled since the early 1990s, according to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute, a think tank that focuses on security issues. Much of that growth has come in the past few years.

Most Russian products on display at the air show are modernized versions of Soviet-designed aircraft. The Su-35, for example, is among many successors to the Su-27, which first flew in 1977. The Kamov Ka-52 combat helicopter, which drew stares with its unusual pair of rotors that spin in opposite directions one atop the other, is an update of a model that first flew in 1982.

The Russian aircraft still lack the cutting-edge electronics of rival Western products and generally require more maintenance, which can get expensive. But the Russian models are robust, extensively tested and relatively inexpensive to buy.

"You get a really sexy looking aircraft that has got some very good capabilities, and you pay remarkably less than for a Western aircraft," said Francis Tusa, editor of Defence Analysis, a British newsletter.

Mr. Pogosyan of United Aircraft said he aims to sell 100 Su-35s outside Russia. He is positioning the aircraft as a rival to Cold War-era Western planes such as Boeing's F-15, the F-16 from Lockheed Martin Corp. and the Eurofighter Typhoon, from a consortium of European companies. The Western producers are taking note of Russia's push.

"They've been putting money into fighter aircraft development" and other products, said Chris Raymond, vice president of business development and strategy at Boeing's defense unit. Mr. Raymond said the most likely markets for Russian planes are countries already flying older models, including India and Malaysia, but he said Russia's global ambitions are clear. "I expect them to be bidding [in] more places around the world."

Russia's drive back onto the global market is intensifying as China is boosting arms exports and U.S. defense companies are chasing more foreign sales. Recent cutbacks in Pentagon spending amid U.S. economic troubles have prompted American defense behemoths, including Lockheed and Boeing. As a result, Europeans and Russians also have stepped up their marketing, say industry officials.

"The battle for the air is heating up," said Alberto de Benedictis, CEO of British operations at Italian aerospace group Finmeccanica SpA, which builds the Eurofighter alongside British defense giant BAE Systems PLC and Airbus parent European Aeronautic Defence & Space Co. In the Persian Gulf, Mr. de Benedictis said, almost every country is shopping for fighter jets, and similar regional arms races are escalating around the globe.

Russia's aviation exports aren't just to military customers. Sales of Russian helicopters—renowned for their power, if not their efficiency—are rising in commercial markets by more than 15% annually, with particular success in India and China, said Igor Pshenichny, deputy director general of the Russian Helicopters unit of industrial holding company Russian Technologies, or Rostec. Against more sophisticated U.S. and European products, "we are very competitive on price," said company spokesman Roman Kirillov.

Sukhoi is also marketing a new short-range passenger jet, dubbed the Superjet 100, which it has already sold in Russia and other countries, including Mexico. But most aviation analysts say Russia's best prospects in global aviation for the near future are in bargain-priced military equipment.

Western aerospace companies acknowledge that Russian products are less expensive. They say that even less-developed countries still should opt for pricier Western equipment because such deals can bring other benefits.

American defense exports, for example, are handled through Washington, which can offer economic and political enhancements to close an important military deal.

Buying U.S. defense systems also can open the door to a range of American support and technology that other countries can't offer, said Patrick Dewar, Lockheed's senior vice president for strategy and business development. "You're getting a relationship with the U.S. government," he said.

 

http://rt.com/in-motion/russia-sukhoi-air-show-019/

kpn.kardif

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2013, 11:59:29 PM »

That is a truly beautiful piece of kit, right there.  I don't normally find jets to be all that interesting, but this one is certainly fun to watch. 

Here's a different perspective of what I think is the same flight, without the clouds getting in the way. 

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GerritJ9

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2013, 03:50:16 AM »

Countries that are currently involved in the JSFiasco programme should withdraw and seriously consider alternatives that work, including Papa Putin's latest. Buy the basic Sukhoi airframe, install Western equipment- from Martin-Baker ejector seats to the latest Western electronics- and you'd most probably have a far more capable aeroplane that the JSF will ever be. And, you'd probably have money left over.
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Typhoon Ib

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2013, 01:30:39 PM »

:D

that would be a kickass plan!

Russian Airframe, Stripped down.
French or European, or any non-US avionics, weapons, engine..  (Not that US stuff aint good... but uncle sam would refuse to put anything amrican in a russki plane that serves  a country like... turkey, greece, germany, belgium, spain, italy... )

And german technicians to take care of the lot.
and training in the alps together with them swiss Dudes and Dudettes, with detachments to the north, for they are good warrios too.

the euro Polits aint even capable to get a goddamned Drone (toy airplane anyone) in the air.
Buy russian, get something that works out of the Box!

Or Buy European... Rafale? Eurofighter? A400M? Lysander? Eurocopter?
F-35...*raises middle finger*
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GerritJ9

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2013, 04:02:06 PM »

You forgot the SAAB Gripen NG :)
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Typhoon Ib

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2013, 05:34:47 PM »

and a few other products.
but i recon even modern "working" euro products have US screws and nuts, bolts and Fanblades in them that Uncle sam forbids us to produce and sell without a written consent.
so with our  tools that work but are chained to shafty transatlantic agreements, we stuck as well.
*grunt*
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GerritJ9

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2013, 02:33:15 AM »

All the more reason to look at alternatives, it's not as if Europe (and the rest of the world) can't build aeroplanes, gas turbines (Rolls-Royce!) etc etc. And switching to metrics is dead easy so we don't need US screws, nut and bolts. The whole world has gone metric except the US. The US doesn't have a monopoly on brains.
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Dark Apostle

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2013, 07:29:39 AM »

:D

that would be a kickass plan!

Russian Airframe, Stripped down.
French or European, or any non-US avionics, weapons, engine..  (Not that US stuff aint good... but uncle sam would refuse to put anything amrican in a russki plane that serves  a country like... turkey, greece, germany, belgium, spain, italy... )

And german technicians to take care of the lot.
and training in the alps together with them swiss Dudes and Dudettes, with detachments to the north, for they are good warrios too.

the euro Polits aint even capable to get a goddamned Drone (toy airplane anyone) in the air.
Buy russian, get something that works out of the Box!

Or Buy European... Rafale? Eurofighter? A400M? Lysander? Eurocopter?
F-35...*raises middle finger*

I like to think if NATO weapons could've been mated with Russian hardpoints the RAAF would be wielding Su-30's rather then funding an aircraft being designed to line Lockheed/Martin's pockets for years to come.
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GerritJ9

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2013, 08:36:00 AM »

Swapping hard points seems like the easiest problem to solve.... something competent fitters should be able to handle.
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Typhoon Ib

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2013, 10:46:23 AM »

sure! full confidence on capable mechaniciens, either on the line or in a workshop n stuff.
No doubt the IT crew can understand and configure the binary code to feed the Radar with the new weapons capabilities.

But there is tests, regulations and standards! paperwork, you see?
and oh the affront! loading a russian rocket on a RAAF F-18C wingtip!
OMFG! the affront to all the AIM-9 users!

And who in the population would understand and agree to do it? The petitions to kick ass on a political level...? The outrage?

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352nd_Hoss

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2013, 08:28:07 PM »

Something else I read this morning...



Sukhoi Test Pilot Explains ‘Supermaneuverability’

Defense Daily    06/24/2013

Author: Bill Sweetman

The high agility demonstrated by the Sukhoi Su-35S fighter at the Paris air show is rooted in a Russian concept in which close-range, low-speed air combat remains important, according to Sukhoi chief test pilot Sergey Bogdan.

The aircraft, equipped with three-axis thrust-vectoring and fully integrated flight and propulsion control, performed maneuvers here which no other operational fighter can match. These include a controlled vertical, flat-attitude descent with the aircraft rotating, and a dynamic deceleration, or “cobra”, leading to a small-radius 180-deg. turn and course reversal. It demonstrated a dynamic deceleration followed by extremely slow flight at a near-90-deg. angle of attack.

“Most of the fighters we have available today with vectored thrust, the Su-30MKI and MKM, can perform these maneuvers,” Bogdan tells Aviation Week. “Where this aircraft is different is that it has more thrust, so when it performs the 'bell' maneuver, it can stand still, with afterburning on, and can sustain flight at 120-140 kph.”

The emphasis in “supermaneuverability” runs counter to much Western air combat doctrine, which stresses high speed, the avoidance of the slower “merge” and tactics that do not lose the aircraft's energy. Bogdan, however, says supermaneuverability can be essential.

“The classical air combat starts at high speed, but if you miss on the first shot—and the probability is there because there are maneuvers to avoid missiles—the combat will be more prolonged,” he says. “After maneuvering, the aircraft will be at a lower speed, but both aircraft may be in a position where they cannot shoot. But supermaneuverability allows an aircraft to turn within three seconds and take another shot.”

However, Bogdan adds, “you have to be careful using that weapon. It's like a sniper—you can't shoot many times from the same spot because you disclose your position.”

As for the doctrine that energy should be conserved, Bogdan notes: “The theory of air combat has always evolved. In the 1940s and 1950s, the first priority was height, then speed, then maneuver and then firepower. Then with the third and fourth generation, it was speed, then height and then maneuver. Supermaneuverability adds to this. It's the knife in the soldier's pocket.”

Bogdan repeats a claim made when the Su-27 first performed the cobra maneuver: The rapid change in velocity can cause a Doppler fire-control radar to break lock. The maneuver is more useful on the Su-35S because the pilot can fly the aircraft out in any direction.

And this:

http://breakingdefense.com/2013/06/20/stars-of-2013-paris-air-show-russian-su-35-european-neuron-uav-no-americans/

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Re: Russians back in business
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2013, 12:47:26 AM »

one dude says: you canna see me, i gotz da stealffff an da soopacruise. i got da long shot gun!
other dude replies: u canna shoot me, i got le matrix bullettime !

interesting concepts.
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