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Author Topic: A new era has come! Stereoscopic 3D (Development thread)  (Read 112990 times)

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benitomuso

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A new era has come! Stereoscopic 3D (Development thread)
« on: November 03, 2011, 12:17:21 PM »

Updated Nov the 13th:


(Screenshot directly taken from the screen)

Ok People,
                          now this is the final V4. It is a big improvement. Most of the problems present in V3c and V4Beta have been solved. I have re-written the ReadMe.pdf including all the details for this new version. I will only detail a couple of highlights, but please read the attached document for the details.


-Updated: In this version you can change the Stereo 3D rendering mode. By pressing simultaneously the Left and Right Buttons and scrolling the Wheel Down, you can select between the next modes:

0-Stereo Disabled
1-Stereo Mode A (the one you saw in v4Beta, that now is the default)
2-Stereo Mode B (the original v3, “flickering” one, but good for some systems).
3-Stereo Mode C (a variant of the V3 with two buffers, non-flickering but slower. Could be very good in some powerful GPUs).
4-Stereo Mode D (a two combined frames version that still doesn't work very good. In some video cards can work OK).

In case you have any kind of problem with the rendering mode you are using, even if you don’t see anything in the screen, you can switch them with the mouse, until you have one of the methods quoted working, or in the worst case the Stereo Disabled mode, that for sure must be visible. The default mode for the start of the game can be established in Conf.ini by:

Code: [Select]
[Mods]
PAL3DStart=1

  Being 1 the default, but all the values specified in the table above are possible (even 0).

-Updated: We can adjust the Stereo Separation with the Right Button + Mouse-wheel. Just moving it while holding the mouse you will be notified in the HUD about the value. Check out what is the best one for you in cockpit, and later set it in Conf.ini (read below for those who don't know about it).

-Updated: Now there is independent adjustment of Internal and External Stereo Separation. This was because correctly adjusted in internal view, the stereo perception outside the plane was quite poor, so now you can have the two settings to make your experience easier.
  All the settings regarding Stereo Separation can be established in Conf.ini to start with your preferred configuration. These are the default values, but change them for your own:

Code: [Select]
[Mods]
PAL3DSeparation=1.5
PAL3DSeparationExt=25.0

-Updated: from V4 onwards, we have the chance of directly capturing Anaglyph 3D Stereo snapshots. Now if you press the PrintScreen or your corresponding key, if you are in Mode A, a full two colors stereo image will be saved. If you are in Mode B, single Red or Cyan images are captured, and later you have to compose them. And if you are with Stereo Disabled, a traditional plane image is stored.
  Added to this capability, now you can select the next in Conf.ini:

Code: [Select]
[Mods]
PAL3DScrShtDir=MyScreenShots/
PAL3DScrShtExt=jpg

  So, if you prefer you can specify a different default folder to save the ScreenShots. The default one is the used by DBW, remember always to place the last “/” to define the directory. You can select through PAL3DScrShtExt the type of file used for the image. For the while .jpg and .tga are the chances. The .tgas are heavy and ugly but they are captured very fast. Any type will record stereo images.

Old Posts:


  Please, I took the time to write a detailed ReadMe.pdf. Read it. It is inside the .rar and includes full instructions for newcomers and for the ones who have already tried it. Changes for v3c (extracted from the ReadMe):

-Updated: You can enable or disable the Stereo effect at any time. By pressing simultaneously the Left and Right Buttons and scrolling the Wheel Down, you Disable the feature and you have default Il-2. By scrolling it Up while holding the Two Buttons you enable it.
 -Updated: We can adjust the stereo separation with the Right Button + Mouse-wheel. Just moving it while holding the mouse you will be notified in the HUD about the value. Check out what is the best one for you in cockpit, and later set it in Conf.ini (read below for those who don't know about it).
 -Updated: Now there is independent adjustment of Internal and External Stereo Separation. This was because correctly adjusted in internal view, the stereo perception outside the plane was quite poor, so now you can have the two settings to make your experience easier.
 -All this 3 last settings can be established in Conf.ini to start with your preferred configuration. These are the default values, but change them for your own:

Code: [Select]
[Mods]
PAL3DStart=1
PAL3DSeparation=1.5
PAL3dSeparationExt=25.0

-Since V3c as you see, the default Internal Stereo Separation is set to 1.5. You will see that with higher values, for inside of cockpits it is too much. But in external views (which now work perfectly), you can set up a Separation of up to 40 without much trouble, and you will see your or the other planes "very very volumetric". Default value is 25.
 -Since V3c Shine and Reflections problems now are basically solved. Playing with DBW default (Carsmasters lightning, etc.) doesn’t produce any undesired effect.
 -You have stereo in the FMB 3D view. See how much easier is placing objects with it!


Sorry for the ones who already were using it that I had to change the mouse behaviour, but it was because the plain wheel movement was used for zooming in FMBPro, so it was necessary to separate the function.

Regards,
                              Pablo



Previous Post:

  Since V3 we have the next:

-The stereo image is deeper than never before. V2 in fact offered really only a "virtual stereo" perception. Here you will be able to make the tip of the wing of a plane to reach your nose. Objects can fully emerge from the screen.
-We can adjust the stereo separation with the mousewheel, just moving it, you will be notified in the HUD about the value. Check what is the best for you in the cockpit, and later set it in Conf.ini (read below for those who don't know about it).
-Now the default Stereo Separation is set to 1.5. You will see that with higher values, for inside cockpits is too much. But in external views (which now work perfectly), you can set up a Separation of up to 40 without much trouble, and you will see your or the other planes "very very volumetric".
-By pressing the right button of the mouse and scrolling the wheel down, you disable the Stereo effect, and you have default Il-2. By setting in the Conf.ini the parameter PAL3DStart you determine if your game starts with 3D enabled or not. Later you can change it on the fly through the mouse.

So, current default configuration in Conf.ini (if you don't change your own parameters) is like this:

Code: [Select]
[Mods]
PAL3DStart=1
PAL3DSeparation=1.5 



As far as I know, apart of the flickering due to the light issue, this one should work in nVIDIA as well as in ATI. You really will prefer VSync-On to deal with these shines.

I still have doubts if this problem could be related to the Carsmaster's lightning MOD, included in DBW. Please, could someone WHO IS POSITIVE that doesn't have that MOD working, confirm if it even shows problems in his computer?

Regards,
                       Pablo


The next images were taken with the current MOD:



Highlights of what is wonderful:

-Fly close to the ground, and the trees, everything, gets a new dimmension
-Try to land into a carrier: much easier, now you can perceive distances!!!
-Fly through the clouds: now you are really flying
-Fly with a hunter through a formation of bombers: wonderful experience



For the ones who haven't read it, please read carefully the Original Post (disregard whatever is said about the flickering, now it is solved):


Recently I have started to make my first experiences with stereoscopic anaglyph for movies I'm filming and briefly I started to be concerned about what we are lossing in Il-2 by not having real 3D, and it really is a whole new world.

I tested a couple of differnet approaches to get anaglyph stereoscopic 3D (those images that you see with the coloured googles).

I have made something "operative". This is a WIP, the easiest but the brute force approach, but it doesn't produce any fps lost.

Download it from here:


Characteristics:

-You need anaglyph red / cyan googles to see the next.
-It has a lot of flickering, specially if you have a slow computer and you are in front of the sun.
-You can see some weird textures appearing somewhere (I still don't know why).
-It only works inside cockpits, not in external view.
-The current and default separation between eyes is set to 19.5cm. You can play with these value to obtain more "stable" and less stressing image. The highest the value, the most dramatic the distant objects become, but more annoying will be the closer objects.
To configure this change this value in Conf.ini:

Code: [Select]
[Mods]
PAL3DSeparation=19.5

In particular, if your googles were with the cyan at your left side, you can set PAL3DSeparation=-19.5, and the minus invert how the half images are shown.

Expect some or bigger improvements in the future. Probably even a different approach to the same, and for sure a much more stable image.

Let's fly 3D!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Regards,
                         Pablo


Original Post:


But it really is a new world. Use some red / cyan googles to see the next.

Cockpits become a wonder when you are flying from inside them:


Install it before any 6DOF MOD you have. It is based on my 6DOF with headshaking MOD, so if you have any other it will become disabled.

You can estimate the distance of the incoming planes, somehting that is so relevant...

Our new Black lady looks wondeful in 3D:


The big problem is that everything must be done through DirectX in the current methods, but the game never worked OK with it. But what I really can't understand is why if you even in DirectX have 60fps rate if you use a software solution like iZ3D it drops to 2fps. I could accept a relationship of 1:2 to say somehting, but not 2:60. Composing every frame cannot take 30 times more.

Worried about this, I have started to think about the chance of generating from inside the game an anaglyph image. I think that it's possible. Have any of you programmed OpenGL in depth as to help me with some theories I would like to test?

Regards,
                      Pablo
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SAS~Malone

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #1 on: November 03, 2011, 12:23:35 PM »

wow! looks like you made some good progress already, mate!
looks really interesting, gonna play with it over the weekend.
looking at the screenshots with my goggles, and i find myself trying to peer around the sides, lol....:D
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LuseKofte

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2011, 12:31:42 PM »

What do we need 3D copitable screen and 3D glasses to connect with it . all this compitable with Nvidia card?
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SAS~Malone

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2011, 12:34:26 PM »

Le0ne, yes, all you need is the 3d glasses, it works fine for me on my 2 CRT monitors, and i don't think the graphics card is relevant, but i stand under correction on that.
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BT~Tarik

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2011, 12:38:29 PM »

Wow, seems to be cool! Unfotunately I got no 3D glasses...
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benitomuso

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2011, 12:51:43 PM »

People,
               all what you need are very basic 3D googles / glasses.

  No special monitor, nothing to do with your graphics card.

  If you don't have them, the DIY is already written. Just use the internet whenever you need something:

http://www.3dglasses2u.com/how-to-diy-3d-glasses/



http://www.jfairstein.com/glasses.html



http://howto.wired.com/wiki/Make_3-D_Glasses


  All what you need to do is hold in front of your left (from your view) eye a semi-translucent red film and in front of the right (from your point of view) a semi-translucent cyan film.

  Regarding the separation: a better adjusted separation can make much more comfortable your experience. First approach to it is meassure the distance between your two eyes in centimeters, multiply it by 2 and set PAL3DSeparation=2 x EyeDistance (in cm). It seems to work pretty well.

  That's a fact that if you have less than 50fps the image can be too flickery. With the current method there's no way to solve it. But I'm thinking about how it can be improved.

  Regards,
                      Pablo

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Silverback

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2011, 12:52:54 PM »

If you can get this to work it will be a giant step forward.
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Uufflakke

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2011, 02:16:32 PM »



Headset: V
Freetrack:  V
Joystick:  V
Rudder Pedals: V
Throttle: V
3D glasses: V

Hopefully no one enters the room when you play IL2. They might think you forgot your medication.  ;D
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NS~mati140

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #8 on: November 03, 2011, 02:32:22 PM »

Headset: V
Freetrack:  V
Joystick:  V
Rudder Pedals: V
Throttle: V
3D glasses: V
Hopefully no one enters the room when you play IL2. They might think you forgot your medication.  ;D


Try Sony HMZ-T1...



... + NaturalPoint TrackIR 5 on 1:1 capture settings...



and ENTER THE MATRIX :P
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shardana

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #9 on: November 03, 2011, 02:37:31 PM »

Unfortunately for us cross eyed pilots it won't work!!! ahhhh me sad.....  :)
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Avala

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2011, 05:53:16 PM »

Unfortunately for us cross eyed pilots it won't work!!! ahhhh me sad.....  :)

You really tried it? Because I'm too strabistic. I tried AVA (shooter) in 3D and some bought glasses, but couldn't saw the difference.
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shardana

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Re: A new era is coming! Stereoscopic 3D: My first crude but working MOD
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2011, 06:08:24 PM »

No way Avala, it's a well known problem, in order to be able to see in 3d we need to have straight view in both eyes, just to appreciate deep sighting fully. I know that we can enjoy a different kind of 3d view that doesn't need glasses. hopefully in the future this system will be the standard one... beside I would take this opportunity to thank you for the great mods that you gave us! ciao
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