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Author Topic: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.  (Read 9475 times)

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Wildchild

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Re: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.
« Reply #24 on: August 01, 2011, 01:39:59 AM »

The thing to is that it's certain aircraft. The ones I can detect it most in are the 109, spit and mustang. Except the 109 is more controllable while the other two you can just twist the rudder and the plane shakes.

I have also noticed it on B-17's, 24's, and 29's
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Hawker17

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Re: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.
« Reply #25 on: August 01, 2011, 02:30:57 AM »

For me this started in earnest when TD released 4.10. In the release readme they proudly anounced that they had tweeked all the Spitfire FMs. Was that a birthday present to CLOD? No, I'm sure it wasn't but it certainly was no gift to me.

So true, 4.10m messed up the Spitfire FM's even more. Thank god there's the MkI & II mod package, which has a better general FM. I agree with the above posts, that the FM's should be more friendly. The gap between digital FM's and realistic FM's is too big. What i stated before, everyone is using a (short) joystick, so the input values should be more friendly. Everybody who flew a real aircraft and FSX knows FSX has pretty good general FM's for flying with a joystick. I hope that will be the goal in IL2 1946.
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SAS~Anto

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Re: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.
« Reply #26 on: August 01, 2011, 06:22:30 AM »

Brat I do notice the Spitfire will wobble its tail if I give it a hard kick with the rudder (smoother movements not so much so) but do not notice any issues with the elevator.

Not going to close this thread but asking if you guys can hold off judgement for a little bit. One of the main components of UP3 full is going to be the new FMs which includes an extensive rework of the Spitfires. 4.101m does fix an issue with the modelling of the wing but mucks up some other values. Kwiatek and crew are using these wing fixes as a basis and tuning the rest of the FM (presumably like the Mk I & II Spitfire models).

As for the rest of the aircraft out there, well, not sure how wrong they are. Since time has started, the 109, Mustang and Spit flight models have always been hot topic for debates and no matter what you do to them, someone is always going to complain. Personally I think the Bf-109 flight models we now have are fantastic and are a vast improvement on the stock versions (particularly for the Gustavs G-6 onwards). Anyway, please continue discussing but bear in mind that these issues may be fixed with UP3 full (and in turn, SAS will adopt some of the FMs)
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Wildchild

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Re: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.
« Reply #27 on: August 01, 2011, 09:45:33 AM »

Anto your right with the 109. It's just if you give the F models too much rudder they do the same thing as the spitfire
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vanir

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Re: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2011, 11:26:22 PM »

Weird, I've always used extreme 3D pro without a problem. I haven't switched because it gives excellent flight performance for $20 versus $300.
All I need is track IR, trying to mouse and keyboard at the same time with one hand that also needs to handle 12 mapped buttons on the flight stick is kind of an overload.

I had to play a lot with mapped axis curves, but essentially the ones in the IL2 pdf handbook work pretty good for all aircraft. I have no rudder problem.


oh I just thought, I've flown light a/c IRL and you do have to be a little heavy handed with the boots sometimes. You get used to it, and the imperfect nature of real world physics in practise. Scary at first, if you're a tenderfoot you probably won't make a very good pilot unless working for a modern airliner. Ooh those guys scare me these days, who licenses some of them?
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Stratodog

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Re: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.
« Reply #29 on: August 06, 2011, 01:33:20 PM »

Hi,

Coming in late to the discussion.  I like it.
Brat, I know you and I have discussed this a little over at Ultrapack.
Brat, could you try out the Spit F 1a, 1939 from UP3, It should be a bit better than the later models.  This one was done by Kwiatek for UP2 and I think it's pretty good.
Also, try the F6F-3 Early, 1943.  I did the FM on this one and I specifically tried to improve the Yaw stability as well as correcting the performance problems in the stock FM.  I think the -3 late and the -5 are my FMs also, but I'm not 100% on that since the FM thing is still in process for UP3. 

I also have a lot of R/L flying time including some Warbird time and I have been pushing for better Yaw stability on some of the FMs.

Cheers
Stratodog
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vanir

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Re: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.
« Reply #30 on: August 06, 2011, 04:06:35 PM »

I stand corrected. I'll just go back to my cave now :P
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brat

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Re: Tail wagging. I’m getting frustrated.
« Reply #31 on: August 06, 2011, 10:38:45 PM »

Hi,

Coming in late to the discussion.  I like it.
Brat, I know you and I have discussed this a little over at Ultrapack.
Brat, could you try out the Spit F 1a, 1939 from UP3, It should be a bit better than the later models.  This one was done by Kwiatek for UP2 and I think it's pretty good.
Also, try the F6F-3 Early, 1943.  I did the FM on this one and I specifically tried to improve the Yaw stability as well as correcting the performance problems in the stock FM.  I think the -3 late and the -5 are my FMs also, but I'm not 100% on that since the FM thing is still in process for UP3. 

I also have a lot of R/L flying time including some Warbird time and I have been pushing for better Yaw stability on some of the FMs.
Cheers
 
Hi again. It's great to hear and see that you remain concerned in regard to these issues.
The Spit F1a 1939 is a dream to fly compared to the later models. It certainly behaves a lot more normal in the rudder department when using a joystick. The F65-3 early also pleases me although the late 3 and 5 remain a bit waggy to my liking.
As an offline flyer only I wish I had the option and the skill to modify these fms for myself. I can only remain hopeful that something will be done with all these abnormal yaw problems in future updates.
Best wishes.
Brat
 
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