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Author Topic: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports  (Read 100288 times)

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OberstDanjeje

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #168 on: September 15, 2011, 12:58:03 PM »

It's not a bug, for sure!!!
The RL G-2 was limited at 1.30 ata, so the 100% power is correct.
the stock G-2 was not limited but it was not correct
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CWMV

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #169 on: September 15, 2011, 01:01:24 PM »

Werent most G-2's were limited to 1.3ata anyway?

No the Bf-109G-2 is identical to the G-1 only that it does not have the pressurized cockpit.
Also the G-4 differs from the G-2 only in different Wheels.

The fact that i cannot increase the power output over 100% is a Bug. Does anybody else have this problem?


No not quite, your forgetting the GM-1 boost in the odd numbered 109's.

And you misunderstand my point, 1.42ata wasn't cleared officially until October 1943 (as far as I can find anyway). Although I understand that it was toyed with in 1942 it was banned due to burning up cylinders until something like June '43, and then officially endorsed in October after D.B released a technical document allowing for it.

I know that Anto has better records than I do, so hopefully he can chime in, but I think the true bug here is that 109's prior to 43 can use 1.42ata.

EDIT: Dammit OberstDanjeje, you beat me to it!  :D
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BaronFel181

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #170 on: September 15, 2011, 04:30:02 PM »

I remember that Anto specifically stated that the G-2 was limited to 1.3 ATA (100% power) for the latest Ultimate 109 patch. I concur with CWMV about the early boost restrictions on the DB-605A. We have an early G-2 with the retracting tail wheel, so the 1.3 ATA boost is pretty appropriate. If you want a 1.42 ATA G-2, you can use parts from the G-2 in the G-4 3D0 folder to create a late G-2 with the fixed larger tailwheel. I have one running in DBW.
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Shardur

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #171 on: September 15, 2011, 07:40:41 PM »

What sources are you using, because i cannot find that anywhere? all I can find is that the G-2 is basically a G-1 minus the pressurized cockpit.
The GM-1 system was supposed to be in all Bf-109G versions that do not have the MW50 but due to shortages it was not installed in all of them. It is however not a system that was just installed in the odd numbered versions like it is in the game. The GM-1 system would add /U2 the the Aircraft designation so a version with the GM-1 would be Bf-109G-1/U2 or Bf-109G-2/U2.

Same goes for the FW-190A-7 to A-9 i do not understand why the boost system MW50 would prevent them from using 110%engine power since the A-3 to A-6 can and they are all using the BMW 801 D-2 Engine.
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Shardur

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #172 on: September 15, 2011, 07:52:07 PM »

I remember that Anto specifically stated that the G-2 was limited to 1.3 ATA (100% power) for the latest Ultimate 109 patch. I concur with CWMV about the early boost restrictions on the DB-605A. We have an early G-2 with the retracting tail wheel, so the 1.3 ATA boost is pretty appropriate. If you want a 1.42 ATA G-2, you can use parts from the G-2 in the G-4 3D0 folder to create a late G-2 with the fixed larger tailwheel. I have one running in DBW.

The sources I can find for the 109 tell me that different wheels (all not just the tailwheel, as visible by the small bumps one the wings) are the only difference between the G-2 and G-4. Again the only difference between the G-2 and G-1 or the G-4 and G-3 should be the pressurized cockpit that can actually be retrofitted by the field mechanik.
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CWMV

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #173 on: September 15, 2011, 08:18:56 PM »

Look a little bit harder.
Bf 109 G-2 Flugzeug-Handbuch, Teil 0, Stand Juni 1942, Ausgabe November 1942.
Shows 1,42 ata Startleistung rating banned.

http://www.kurfurst.org/Engine/Boostclearances/DB605A_ban_Jun-10Nov42_G2FzgHB-T6-Full.JPG

See here:
 1) "Darf nicht benutzt werden, ist blockiert."

1.42ata cleared here Bf 109 G-2 Flugzeug-Handbuch, Teil 0, Stand August 1943, Ausgabe October 1943

http://www.kurfurst.org/Engine/Boostclearances/DB605A_clearance_Aug-Oct43_G2FzgHB-T0-Full.JPG
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Shardur

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #174 on: September 15, 2011, 08:38:02 PM »

Nice, but the fact that the Higher Power settings of the Engine where blocked in the early versions (in the beginning) of the G-2 do not justify it being blocked in the game for 2 reasons:
The first and more important one being that the plane was used longer and the game supports campaigns past 1942.
The second one being that it was possible for the field mechanik to take the block out.

I would like the current version as a "G-2 early" and the G-2 restored to the original state of being able to increase engine power above 100% as it is used in many missions and campaigns that where created with the 110% power setting in mind. However i do not know how to do that so I would be thankfull if someone could help me with that.
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CWMV

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #175 on: September 15, 2011, 08:51:42 PM »

Well that's all well and good, but don't hold your breath.
Slots are being cut WAY back, including the 109 slots, so unless they want to add it in as a loadout option (if that's even possible) they probably wont add another slot just for this.

What I can see them doing is going with the aircraft, as it was used, in the time period it was relevant=1.3ata.
Just because there were some truly unlucky schlubs that had to fly G-2's in '44 and '45 doesn't mean that the aircraft itself should be modeled around it. Most of the aircraft seem to be modeled ( and rightly so) as they were when developed/fielded.

As to the possibility of removing the block, that was the problem in the first place! They made this mandatory because of engine problems that were being experienced in the field, not as some sort of arbitrary "thou shall not" rule.
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BaronFel181

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #176 on: September 15, 2011, 09:11:24 PM »

.
I remember that Anto specifically stated that the G-2 was limited to 1.3 ATA (100% power) for the latest Ultimate 109 patch. I concur with CWMV about the early boost restrictions on the DB-605A. We have an early G-2 with the retracting tail wheel, so the 1.3 ATA boost is pretty appropriate. If you want a 1.42 ATA G-2, you can use parts from the G-2 in the G-4 3D0 folder to create a late G-2 with the fixed larger tailwheel. I have one running in DBW.

The sources I can find for the 109 tell me that different wheels (all not just the tailwheel, as visible by the small bumps one the wings) are the only difference between the G-2 and G-4. Again the only difference between the G-2 and G-1 or the G-4 and G-3 should be the pressurized cockpit that can actually be retrofitted by the field mechanik.

The only thing that truly differentiated a G-2 from G-4 was the radio equipment. A G-2 could have the larger diameter fixed tail wheel and wider main wheels (requiring the bulge on the top of the wing) and not be a G-4
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Shardur

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #177 on: September 15, 2011, 09:57:23 PM »

Well the Bf-109F-4 has 2 versions one with the block and one without, i would like that also for the G-2. If I knew how i would do it myself, sadly i don't.

Also can someone tell me how the GM-1 System is supposed to be used in game? I only manage to burn my engine out with it.

And is it historically accurate that the FW-190 versions with MW50 can only run the engine up to 1.3ata without the boost in game? (and also and more important are the versions with MW50 in game more powerfull than the versions without MW50 because so far I'm not entirely sure that is true)
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BaronFel181

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #178 on: September 16, 2011, 12:18:20 AM »

Only the FW-190Ds use MW-50 and the Doras with it are more powerful than the only Dora without it, the D-9 1944 version. According to the IL-2 compare data for the new DBW 190 flight models, the late D-9 (MW-50) is a little 20 km/h faster at sea level than the early D-9 (no MW-50).

I believe that 6,500 meters is the critical altitude for GM-1 in game, but I could be wrong.
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CWMV

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Re: DBW Current Build All Bug Reports
« Reply #179 on: September 16, 2011, 01:08:20 AM »

Well the Bf-109F-4 has 2 versions one with the block and one without, i would like that also for the G-2. If I knew how i would do it myself, sadly i don't.

Also can someone tell me how the GM-1 System is supposed to be used in game? I only manage to burn my engine out with it.

And is it historically accurate that the FW-190 versions with MW50 can only run the engine up to 1.3ata without the boost in game? (and also and more important are the versions with MW50 in game more powerfull than the versions without MW50 because so far I'm not entirely sure that is true)

Well thats just it, slot merges are coming and there aren't going to be multiple representations of the same plane. So hopefully they err on the side of history when it comes to the slot merges.
its just an FM change, easy stuff take ya 10 minutes... :D

GM-1 will only work at altitude. Theres actually a formula for figuring out the correct altitude but I just stick with 6000-7000 meters as the altitude to engage GM-1. Any lower and it will burn your motor out.
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