Special Aircraft Service

Individual Mod Downloads for IL-2 1946 => Other Mods => Cockpits (Common) => Topic started by: WxTech on October 14, 2021, 12:10:31 AM

Title: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 14, 2021, 12:10:31 AM
NOTE: Oct 21, 2021, 20:40 UTC. Thanks to an enthusiast of this bird for pointing this out... The stock error in the coding of the Tachometer scaling has been fixed. If you grabbed thismod before reading this, download the full, updated archive again to enjoy a properly reading Tach. The change has been made to the cockpit classfiles only; nothing else has been altered.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

NOTE: Oct 14, 2021, 14:00 UTC. After getting a question about the disconnected antenna wire, I found that it would involve only a little work to fix; it now shows as nicely single, with no breaks. Along the way, I fixed the gyro compass, as the stock code has it behaving exactly like the magnetic compass (bad!). I also created a new texture for the few instruments showing a damaged version, so that they share the same underlying texture as the undamaged ones. The full archive has been updated, and the revised readme file contents are reproduced below.

----------------------------------------------------

Improved F2A-1 cockpit, for 4.12 and B.A.T. (useable with earlier versions if removing the four classfiles)


Here we see the notable increase in the range of virtual head movement in the fore-aft axis via the increased 6dof limits in the cockpit class. No need to ever hit the 'gunsight' view key now! In the up-down and left-right axes there is also a nice boost in freedom of movement. The gun sight reflector has been improved, and a proper circular reticle mask replaces the stock 'square' one. In my update I fixed the displaced antenna wire, which you see as it *was* in the top panel below.

(https://i.imgur.com/VpHGIkF.jpg)


Get it here:

https://www.mediafire.com/file/wxfm9tjfd1t4jvf/%252100_WxTech_F2A-1_Cockpit_Tweaks.7z/file


From the included readme file:


WxTech's tweaks for the B-239 (Finnish Buffalo, a.k.a. F2A-1)

This cockpit fix will work for 4.12 and B.A.T.


If you wish to try it with an earlier game version, DO NOT use the included four cockpit classfiles! This means you will lose the expanded 6dof range limits and the corrected speedometer.


The files present here are current to B.A.T. 4.0. I've included all cockpit files, even though a good number haven't been altered by me. This makes for a complete package of all resources upon which to effect additional changes by anyone so inclined.



What's been fixed:

- Second release, Oct 21, 2021... The stock RPM gauge was badly coded, scaled to peak at 2,000RPM at 1 full rotation of the needle (pointing straight up, where the scale reads 2,500 RPM). It's now been corrected to peak at 3,500RPM at 1.5 rotations (540 degrees, or needle pointing straight down.)

- The CAMERA view hook (the 'normal' viewpoint) has been centered on the gun sight axis. Furthermore, both view hooks (the other being CAMERAAIM, for the 'gunsight' view) have been moved farther forward.

- The cockpit class has had the 6dof limits increased. Enjoy a significantly expanded range of virtual head movement!

- The gun sight reflector plate has been improved.

- A circular mask replaces the stock 'square' one.

- Some additional canopy frame bits have been added.

- The canopy glass has had my usual treatment.

- The airspeed indicator has never been correct, to my recollection. The gauge face has been altered to a scaling for km/h, and the code in the cockpit class corrected. The gauge is now correct to within a couple or few km/h, at least from 100 km/h and up.

- The gyro compass formerly bahaved exactly like the magnetic compass, with a delayed response and a bank limit on freedom of movement. These limits have been reduced/removed, and so now the gyro compass has crisper response and freely turns at all bank angles.

- The single damaged gauge texture has been updated to reflect the undamaged underlying texture.

- The antenna wire forward end has been correctly located at the attachment point on the post, so that now the internal and external models show no gaps.

- Other graphical touches have been imparted, and some bad surface normals have been fixed.



The four cockpit classfiles (compiled/hashed 2021-10-14 9:49AM):
  32D6D860570A8AF6
  C572203C06B0C572
  F65A54BC5D461E02
  F668394AA1662B60

Included also is the CockpitF2A1.java file.




As always with my mods, this work is available for use by any and all, for any purpose whatsoever, without restriction.


WxTech
Oct 14, 2021
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: marcost on October 14, 2021, 01:54:39 AM
Good improvement, thank you. Can anything be done about the radio wire that is hanging in mid-air near the mast on the nose?

Regards

M
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 14, 2021, 03:07:49 AM
The wire appears to terminate mid air because the nearer part is clipped due to the visibility cut box centered on the player's PoV, which is necessary so that the external model not be 'mixed in' with the internal 'pit model. The only way out is either to remove the wire from the external model, or add the wire to the cockpit model. The latter course requires to pretty closely match the two so that where they overlap there is no obvious separation, with two wires running close beside each other. This could be part of the closing up of the near part of the cowling.

This little project took care of the worst stuff bugging me. I have higher priority things to tackle before I'd entertain fixing external model gaps here.  ;)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 14, 2021, 04:51:51 AM
I clearly wasn't paying attention before replying about the antenna wire gap. I just looked into it, and I see that the already present mesh adding the one straight wire segment in the cockpit folder had the forward end a few centimeters out of position, clearly missing the top of the forward antenna post. I just relocated that forward attachment point, and all is now correct.

I figure I might as well fix another thing or two before posting an update.

One is the gyro compass, which is coded to to behave the same as the magnetic compass. I'll make that correct, for sure.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: marcost on October 14, 2021, 05:25:52 AM
Nice one, well done!
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: henkypenky on October 14, 2021, 05:50:49 AM
Very niet cockpit update, a candidate for permanent inclusief in BAT. Woud love to see a similar mk 1  version.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 14, 2021, 08:14:01 AM
Note: I've updated the full archive, which fully replaces the first one posted. Same d/l link in the top post.

After getting a question about the displaced antenna wire, I decided to fix it, as well as the gyro compass behavior. And I made a proper damaged instrument gauge texture, to match the undamaged one.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: rkalhorn109 on October 14, 2021, 08:32:08 AM
Gorgeous!
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Peter Lynn on October 14, 2021, 08:35:51 AM
Thank you for an outstanding contribution WX!
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Strawkalling on October 14, 2021, 02:45:47 PM
Please forgive my newbie type question, WxTech, but, since I've never replaced/upgraded a cockpit before, how exactly do I add this to BAT?

Strawkalling
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 14, 2021, 02:56:22 PM
Please forgive my newbie type question, WxTech, but, since I've never replaced/upgraded a cockpit before, how exactly do I add this to BAT?

Strawkalling

In your game's folder structure you'll see #WAW3. Simply drop my folder

!00_WxTech_F2A-1_Cockpit_Tweaks

into #WAW3.

The way it's named, with the preceding "!00", should ensure that it resides very near the top of the folder listing inside #WAW3. The reason for this is to have my modded classfiles (the strange files whose names are comprised of a long string of letters/numbers) read before any same-named classfiles residing in one or more of the folders containing piles of classes.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: mikojan3 on October 15, 2021, 11:03:28 AM
simply stunning dear wxtech stunniiing
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Strawkalling on October 15, 2021, 02:27:17 PM
WxTech, Thanks for the simple, clear, concise answer! I really like flying the various Finnish aircraft and missions, so this will be a great addition and will see frequent use!  ;D

Strawkalling
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: marcost on October 16, 2021, 01:13:37 AM
Thanks for the fix!
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: oldschoolie on October 18, 2021, 05:51:32 AM
I cannot thank WxTech highly enough for all the wonderful improvements to so many cockpits. Absolutely great work.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Fulmen on October 21, 2021, 09:22:15 AM
I've played IL-2 since 2005 and as a Finnish military history buff with a soft spot for WW2 combat aviation, the Brewster B-239 is by far my most flown aircraft in the game. I just tested your mod and it's a massive improvement to flying the aircraft. I wasn't at all happy with how BAT had changed the POV to be unrealistically high in the cockpit. Also looking around with TrackIR in the aircraft is now much smoother and more natural than before. I'm very pleased with your changes. I do however have an improvement for you, and a question.

Firstly, there's another Brewster B-239 cockpit mod out there that uses considerably better-looking, higher resolution textures. I recommend updating your mod with those. I don't remember who made it, and I'm fairly certain the original links to the mod are dead, but I have it on my PC and I uploaded it for you here: https://www.mediafire.com/file/3wqnxrplv354c35/0_F2A+.zip/file

I slapped the texture files from it onto your mod on my installation and everything seems to be working fine.

Secondly, do you have any plans to fix the RPM gauge? At even moderately high power settings/speeds it goes to 2,500 where it caps out and becomes completely useless. In reality the B-239 with its R-1820-G5 engine flew at noticeably lower RPMs, see the following ratings:

(https://i.postimg.cc/NfJqBBCq/B-239-Engine-Ratings.png) (https://postimages.org/)

Source: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TzvY9V9Lk1tC40T0HMb0gXwmANSEMqSF/view?usp=sharing (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TzvY9V9Lk1tC40T0HMb0gXwmANSEMqSF/view?usp=sharing), page 17.

(https://i.postimg.cc/C1DRr2QZ/R-1820-G5-Specs.png) (https://postimg.cc/njFVC3ZZ)

Source: http://www.enginehistory.org/Piston/Wright/C-WSpecsAfter1930.pdf (http://www.enginehistory.org/Piston/Wright/C-WSpecsAfter1930.pdf), page 7.

(https://i.postimg.cc/J4jfxC5w/R-1820-G5-Specs-2.png) (https://postimg.cc/zVX2DMQp)
(https://i.postimg.cc/4xJS173t/R-1820-G5-Specs-3.png) (https://postimages.org/)
(https://i.postimg.cc/VLF75fFN/R-1820-G5-Specs-4.png) (https://postimages.org/)
(https://i.postimg.cc/GtCQhV8Y/R-1820-G5-Specs-5.png) (https://postimg.cc/xJ6H6sPT)

Source: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FmTeM659MQsU0nJzkIulwXbkidFitxQ5/view?usp=sharing (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FmTeM659MQsU0nJzkIulwXbkidFitxQ5/view?usp=sharing), p. 23, 24, 35, 36.

Either the RPM gauge is completely screwed up, or the aircraft is capable of maintaining too high RPMs for too long. My understanding of it is that it's a question of both, but that most of the blame lies with the RPM gauge.

There's actually also a lot of other issues with how the aircraft is modelled in the game, though to no fault of modders. As far as I know the plane is not as agile as it was IRL; it's especially too prone to stalling. This becomes very noticeable in tight turns.

There are numerous mistakes with the in-game cockpit, like buttons in the wrong places, instruments that are wrong or missing entirely, like the missing air intake temperature gauge on the left-hand instrument panel and the hydraulic system pressure gauge on the right-hand instrument panel, both of which were present in the actual B-239s, as well as missing radio equipment, bomb controls (B-239s didn't carry bombs, but had the controls for them in the cockpit) and various other switches and knobs, etc. The flaps status is also erroneously inverted, while curiously the gear status indicator is correct. As far as I can tell the in-game fuel mixture, propeller pitch and supercharger controls are all mixed up as well: in-game prop. pitch = RL fuel mixture, in-game fuel mixture = RL supercharger and what may be supposedly the in-game supercharger = RL prop. pitch. The tail wheel locking switch positions are also reversed in the B-239 as opposed to the Allied Buffaloes added later in Pacific Fighters, and judging by the cockpit of BW-372, the last surviving B-239, the position is wrong in the in-game B-239s and correct in the Allied Buffaloes. In general a lot of these mistakes aren't present in the Allied Buffalo models, but the devs never went back to fix them in the B-239. It'd also be nice if the canopy could be opened and closed like on the Allied Buffaloes.

You can take a look at what remains of BW-372's cockpit through this link. It's straight down the left corridor from the camera's starting position.

http://ilmavoimamuseo.fi/virtualmuseum/ (http://ilmavoimamuseo.fi/virtualmuseum/)

Anyway, this turned into a bit of a rant, but I just wanted to point out some of the things wrong with the plane in the game. I by no means expect modders to fix all of them. What you've done so far is already really nice and I'm looking forward to starting a new Finnish Brewster campaign with your changes.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 21, 2021, 01:36:57 PM
Thanks for the heads up!

I've just fixed the Tachometer in the cockpit class. Download the full archive again.

The stock gauge code was formerly scaled to peak at 2,000RPM and 360 degrees of rotation. That is, the needle would hit a hard stop when the needle was pointing straight up upon the RPM reaching 2,000, and moving no further. Moreover, this place on the dial corresponds to 2,500 RPM, so it was doubly wrong.

The code now reflects the gauge scaling, where the RPM reading peaks at 3,500RPM at 1.5 rotations (540 degrees, where the needle points straight down.) Not that it'll ever get this high.  ;)

At least there is now internal consistency, where the game's RPM value is reflected by the gauge.

As for some of the other problems, some will not be so quick a fix. And some might involve the flight model, which area I've not ventured into. I don't anticipate tackling any of your other wish list items anytime soon, as other higher priority projects are on the front burners. This RPM thing was a dead easy and fast thing to rectify.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 21, 2021, 01:45:28 PM
Fulmen,
I forgot to mention this. I downloaded the cockpit repaint you pointed to. Other than a relatively small number generally small differences, the textures are essentially identical to those I already supplied with my 'pit.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 21, 2021, 03:45:52 PM
Big thanks to WXTech for your job. For a few days I have been sitting over textures, I will bring a few changes and will drop here.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Fulmen on October 21, 2021, 04:58:41 PM
Thanks for the heads up!

I've just fixed the Tachometer in the cockpit class. Download the full archive again.

The stock gauge code was formerly scaled to peak at 2,000RPM and 360 degrees of rotation. That is, the needle would hit a hard stop when the needle was pointing straight up upon the RPM reaching 2,000, and moving no further. Moreover, this place on the dial corresponds to 2,500 RPM, so it was doubly wrong.

The code now reflects the gauge scaling, where the RPM reading peaks at 3,500RPM at 1.5 rotations (540 degrees, where the needle points straight down.) Not that it'll ever get this high.  ;)

At least there is now internal consistency, where the game's RPM value is reflected by the gauge.

As for some of the other problems, some will not be so quick a fix. And some might involve the flight model, which area I've not ventured into. I don't anticipate tackling any of your other wish list items anytime soon, as other higher priority projects are on the front burners. This RPM thing was a dead easy and fast thing to rectify.

Really great stuff man, thanks a lot! The broken tachometer (forgot the proper name for it :D) was one of the more glaring issues with the aircraft that had been bugging me for quite a while.

Fulmen,
I forgot to mention this. I downloaded the cockpit repaint you pointed to. Other than a relatively small number generally small differences, the textures are essentially identical to those I already supplied with my 'pit.

Here I disagree: the textures I linked are substantially higher in quality. Here are a few comparisons. I recommend enlarging the images by clicking on them.

(https://i.postimg.cc/DfD1Tnbp/gfxmod1.png) (https://postimg.cc/pyfmQNCK)

(https://i.postimg.cc/1RLMKpMz/gfxmod2.png) (https://postimg.cc/ThJrd5z8)

(https://i.postimg.cc/zGkj54NL/gfxmod3.png) (https://postimg.cc/XrpFkHp3)

The only thing I kind of prefer in the lower resolution cockpit are some of the text plates (and the rudder pedals actually; the ones in the B-239 were entirely smooth-surfaced as far as I've seen), as they're more in line with looking like the real ones. I experimented with removing F2ATitles.mat & .tga and F2Atitles1.mat & .tga and this is what it looks like.

(https://i.postimg.cc/XvRmBTZV/gfxmod4.png) (https://postimg.cc/1gKJL7cT)

There's also a texture anomaly with the turn-and-slip indicator from the higher resolution cockpit that I've highlighted that should be removed, which I might do myself if I learn how. Maybe I'll fix the pedals and flaps position indicator as well.

(https://i.postimg.cc/v8LkD2Gs/gfxmod5.png) (https://postimg.cc/3WNncByS)

This with just F2ATitles removed. I think I might prefer the first configuration with both files removed.

The problem with using these parts of the lower resolution cockpit is that when zooming in the text is noticeably garbled, where as that does not happen in the higher resolution mod. Not sure which configuration I'll go with, but I'll definitely be using the higher resolution textures for the rest of the cockpit.

By the way a little off-topic, but which programs do you use to refurbish the cockpits in the game and fix things like adjusting the pilot's default POV? I noticed you've worked on quite a few other planes as well.

EDIT: Also what is the purpose of the cockpit .tga files starting with a hyphen? And I suppose using the textures from the higher resolution mod can result in some weirdness when some of the damaged instrument .tga files are based on the lower resolution versions of the same instruments (sometimes with quite large differences in gauge displays)?
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 22, 2021, 01:15:56 AM
Fulmen,
I thought you were referring to a more widespread, global difference in the cockpit texture resolution. I see now that you are concerned with those relatively small number of meaningful differences I found. The text placards were not so important to this non Finn  ;)  , and so the less sharp but stylistically nicer ones were better for me.

For texture work I use the free Photoshop CS2, available from Adobe. Of one could use GIMP. For maximum versatility, the graphics editor must be able to handle alpha channels, which are what provide the transparency cutouts present in some textures.

For editing meshes, I use Notepad, in conjunction with a spreadsheet when dealing with the 3D model. But for adjusting the POV, Notepad alone is all you need. Once you have the relevant mesh extracted and converted to ASCII (if originally in binary.)

If you open Body.msh  in Notepad, near the top you'll see the view hooks section,  with an entry for the 'normal' POV called CAMERA, and another entry for the 'gunsight view' called CAMERAAIM. For each, the first 9 numbers are the transformation matrix. The last three are what concerns us, for these are the X, Y and Z values that locate the POV. There is no global standard for all cockpits as to which axis corresponds to the fore-aft, L-R and up-down directions. I usually try changes, 9ne at a time, of about 0.2m to see how the POV has shifted, then refine things once the axis orientations are known. I typically add a coded entry to record this. The 6 letters being F and B, U and D, and L and R. You can divine their meaning. These indicate, in order, the direction the POV moves when the relevant number increases in value. And the units are meters.

Any file having a preceding "-" is rendered as ignored by the game. It's usually an alternate, or an original first used, then supplanted by another. If you like a "-" named file, remove the preceding "-" in its name and rename or delete the now unwanted file.

Occasionally I might let slip through a file having a preceding "-" character, but also with some other characters added at the end. For example, -Body_original.msh, or some such. Just removing the "-" will not render it readable, for the file name still differs from that expected.

I first flew Il-2 in 2004. After a few years of using mods, I started down the modding path in 2014  by fiddling with mods I got and wanted to improve upon. For a while this was confined to tweaking textures and effects files. Then soon enough I desperately wanted a better N-2 gunsight for the Wildcat and P-40E. I figured out how meshes work by studying a very simple one for a building. Then I got to making a new sight from scratch using a spreadsheet to construct a whole new 3D model, and made new textures, and figured out the surface normal business for lighting, and laboriously mapped the textures to the model. A grueling process, but eminently satisfying.

I suspect you might be about to jump into modding, even if on a more restricted level. It's great fun to solve problems yourself.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: SAS~vampire_pilot on October 22, 2021, 03:13:12 AM
a text editor is where the downfall starts ;)

Quote
Any file having a preceding "-" is rendered as ignored by the game. It's usually an alternate, or an original first used, then supplanted by another. If you like a "-" named file, remove the preceding "-" in its name and rename or delete the now unwanted file.

That is true for hashed class files but that this is a general rule for any file, mesh or mat or tga, is news to me.
You can call them what you want as long as your are consistent with the him  (not sure if a - is an allowed character in general though, like % or / or ; )
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 22, 2021, 03:38:37 AM
I just noticed that the old stock VSI, calibrated linearly to +/-20 m/s and the correct one, has been replaced as new stock in BAT, anyway, by the US modeled texture, which has a 2-stage scaling to +/-6,000 fpm. The cockpit class code still has the (correct) +/-20 m/s scaling on this gauge. And so I just made a new texture to suit (based on the old original, but jazzed up slightly to overcome the horrible plainness.)

I'll see if anything else crops up by way of an easy fix before I pump out another update. But I'll let you know here when I do.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: cestode on October 22, 2021, 05:42:52 PM
Thank you so much for fixing the tachometer. I'm pretty new to this game and am slowly learning CEM. I was really getting frustrated trying to manage the RPMs for this plane and assumed that I was reading the gauge wrong.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 23, 2021, 08:42:00 AM
Big thanks to WXTech for your job. For a few days I have been sitting over textures, I will bring a few changes and will drop here.

I look forward to seeing your work. Indeed, I wish more modders got to grips with many of the older stock cockpits, further refining what I regard as the core of our beloved sim--WWII.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 24, 2021, 09:53:49 AM
Big thanks to WXTech for your job. For a few days I have been sitting over textures, I will bring a few changes and will drop here.

I look forward to seeing your work. Indeed, I wish more modders got to grips with many of the older stock cockpits, further refining what I regard as the core of our beloved sim--WWII.

Only minor amendments hahaha  ;D were supposed to be. But I finished this ...   ;D I paint a new texture, other changes, or I am introducing a patch. Near the end. Only minor amendments hahaha were supposed to be. But I finished this ... I paint a new texture, other changes, or I am introducing a patch. Near the end. I will drop here.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 24, 2021, 11:25:18 AM
I have always irritated these terrible default low-resolution textures in the cockpit. So I paint a new one, here for example a new texture F2Asidewals (1024x1024) for F2A-1 which in the old version was deadly terrible.

(https://images90.fotosik.pl/547/3ce67fa673e50168.jpg)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Fulmen on October 24, 2021, 09:36:58 PM
I visualized some of the issues with the cockpit that I talked about earlier with my "amazing" Paint skills. I'll also post some comparisons.

The left side of the in-game cockpit:

(https://i.postimg.cc/HLbDbs1N/B-239-cockpit-issues-left-hand-side.png) (https://postimg.cc/t1RMjbTd)

The left side of the F2A-1's cockpit, which was almost identical to the left side of the B-239's cockpit:

(https://i.postimg.cc/yx8XjJ4Y/Brewster-F2-A-1-cockpit-left-hand-side.png) (https://postimg.cc/Q9vTxddR)

The left side of what remains of the last surviving B-239's cockpit. Note that some instruments and gauges are missing on account of damage from being at the bottom of a lake for 56 years and looting by a Russian mob who damaged the aircraft and stole parts of it when it was originally lifted from an East Karelian lake in 1998.

(https://i.postimg.cc/ydLgjvy2/BW-372-cockpit1.png) (https://postimg.cc/62Gp5VSh)

The right side of the in-game cockpit:

(https://i.postimg.cc/Y2dDmnMj/B-239-cockpit-issues-right-hand-side.png) (https://postimg.cc/XXykRgZ0)

The right side of the F2A-1's cockpit:

(https://i.postimg.cc/sfwntz2Z/F2-A-2-cockpit2.png) (https://postimages.org/)

The right side of what remains of the last surviving B-239's cockpit:

(https://i.postimg.cc/4dm9dM9B/BW-372-cockpit2.png) (https://postimg.cc/qhHRD1Q3)

And finally the in-game F2A-2 cockpit, which is markedly more accurately modelled, complete with a working propeller pitch control, starter handle, etc., though it has several flaws as well:

(https://i.postimg.cc/8cxJvsTY/F2-A-2-cockpit.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/q6XvVJhc)

There are other inaccuracies with the in-game B-239 cockpit as well, like missing labels, instruments and screws that are in the wrong places, etc., but that should cover most of them. You can make out the rest from the comparison images I posted.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 24, 2021, 10:33:25 PM
It seems like a new B-239 (F2A-1) 'pit could be built, based on the F2A-2 and tweaked where necessary. I just might jump on it...
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Fulmen on October 25, 2021, 12:05:31 AM
It seems like a new B-239 (F2A-1) 'pit could be built, based on the F2A-2 and tweaked where necessary. I just might jump on it...

That might be a good idea, if you have the time for it. I know this Finn would appreciate it. ;D

EDIT: In case it may be of use, here's the B-239's instrument arrangement and lubrication chart, which also denotes the position of some things in the cockpit, like the bomb controls, taken from the Brewster Aeronautical Corporation's Erection and Maintenance Instructions: Model 239 Airplane: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1kai3tTP8BgiWiu-3XysWCb4t5sqOROwg. As you know, the aircraft's actual setup differed from the chart in terms of the compass under the gunsight and additional directional gyro in the top-right.

(https://i.postimg.cc/XNHVyHwF/F2-A-1-instrument-arrangement.png) (https://postimg.cc/kDSr0yYX)

(https://i.postimg.cc/bwb8Wq4H/F2-A-1-lubrication-chart.png) (https://postimg.cc/5XxZFW46)

Here's also a few more images of BW-372's cockpit from better angles, taken from a book specifically on the cockpits of Finnish military aircraft.

(https://i.postimg.cc/QtsTHX2j/319f036c-c519-419a-8c54-7a45c8af05f2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/948MkjXk)

(https://i.postimg.cc/2y9bcnV5/358daea4-3eac-4ac0-b5ad-310ec38894a0.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/N2TjL98h)

(https://i.postimg.cc/GpvDLBSM/98e94547-02c6-4ce7-b3ec-b12b1293c6f1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/QBxCSMD5)

(https://i.postimg.cc/NFj2kdGV/c4bc68fd-da4d-489e-a3dd-bc67c4b9c899.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/zb4fJSgS)

(https://i.postimg.cc/hjr7mknT/d302d931-c60c-46c8-9163-f86d52247997.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/8J75Qnjz)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 25, 2021, 04:52:31 AM
Well, I've started my labours. Because I'm using the Poor Man's 3D package, meaning a spreadsheet, it'll take a bit longer than it would for someone having proper modeling software.  ;)

One thing that will be made better is the gauges being placed just behind the panel, seen through transparency cutouts, instead of the existing F2A-1 'pit having the gauges floating in front of the panel.

The canopy will be improved in the bargain. Currently the frontmost frame arch of the stock F2A-1is currently slightly curved all long its length, where actually it should be straight. It will be made straight, while the rest of the arches will bow slightly outward as they already correctly do.

Moreover, the current model of all Buffalos has the canopy peak quite 'flattened down', whereas the real thing was rather more 'pointed', with a surprisingly sharp peak along its length. This new F2A-1 will be more properly sharply peaked.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: cestode on October 25, 2021, 01:15:42 PM
I love the attention to detail that this community has. It's great to see people volunteering their time to update a variant of an 80 year old plane in a game that is 15 years old!
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Fulmen on October 26, 2021, 04:46:31 AM
This is not related to the cockpit, but because I brought up the faulty, stall-prone in-game flight model of the Brewster Model 239 earlier and just read something interesting, I wanted to share it here. On the 30th of December, 1939, the well-known American test pilot James Taylor test flew one of the stripped down B-239s meant for Finland, temporarily registered as NX15694, and had this to say (and I'm paraphrasing, because the quote has been translated to Finnish and I couldn't find the original in English):

It is one of the most enjoyable machines I've ever flown. It has no tendencies whatsoever to stall at high angles of attack and high g-forces unlike most low-wing aircraft. It's even better than most bi-planes. Its agility at great speeds depends entirely on what the pilot is capable of withstanding.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 26, 2021, 08:27:14 AM
I stayed with 4.08 for quite a few years, upgrading to 4.09 long after 4.13 appeared, then jumping to 4.12.2, and not long after to BAT 4.0. When I upped to 4.12.2, I noted the decrease in performance compared to 4.08/4.09.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 26, 2021, 03:00:56 PM
This is not related to the cockpit, but because I brought up the faulty, stall-prone in-game flight model of the Brewster Model 239 earlier and just read something interesting, I wanted to share it here. On the 30th of December, 1939, the well-known American test pilot James Taylor test flew one of the stripped down B-239s meant for Finland, temporarily registered as NX15694, and had this to say (and I'm paraphrasing, because the quote has been translated to Finnish and I couldn't find the original in English):

It is one of the most enjoyable machines I've ever flown. It has no tendencies whatsoever to stall at high angles of attack and high g-forces unlike most low-wing aircraft. It's even better than most bi-planes. Its agility at great speeds depends entirely on what the pilot is capable of withstanding.

Sir. Fulmen
There is a solution to the problems with proper flight behavior of the Buffalo. The new FM for the B-239 was made by our friend Vasia from AviaSkins, search in the tab "Самая" правильная "ФМ" - (The most "correct" FM). Now Buffaloes fly according to "book specifications", like a dream  ;D
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Griffon_301 on October 27, 2021, 12:22:08 AM
that thread has 145 pages :) could you provide a download-link maybe?
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 27, 2021, 04:17:34 AM
that thread has 145 pages :) could you provide a download-link maybe?

Hi Griffon_301
OK. After this time I do not remember where the page number was. Two cups of coffee later  :)
http://forum.aviaskins.com/showthread.php?t=2949&page=100
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Griffon_301 on October 27, 2021, 04:49:02 AM
Awesome! Thanks a lot :)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 27, 2021, 04:59:05 AM
Awesome! Thanks a lot :)

Oki  ;)
In this bookmark, they are FM for the default aircraft "Самая" правильная "фм". In this for new modified planes "Новые самолеты. Обсуждение"
Have fun. For the pilot, it's like a candy store. Vasya doing a good job.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Griffon_301 on October 27, 2021, 05:45:47 AM
I fully agree! I have a few of his modified FMs up and running and really like them...
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 27, 2021, 07:16:56 AM
I just tried that new flight model from Aviaskins in my BAT 4.0 game. It seems like the maneuverability has improved, based on my now being rather more competitive against Hurricanes. But I'd like to know how to ascertain for certain that it's really in operation. I see no entry in log.lst indicating the loading of an 'external' flight model, but then I'm not sure if BAT outputs these advisories to the log. I have some niggling doubts, based on the fact that I can't see the new weapon option for the LKk42 guns, which I see in the plane class.

Is there something additional I need to do, besides dropping the mod into #WAW3 (and naming it so that it lies above any other folders which might share same-named resources, of course)?
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 27, 2021, 07:52:52 AM
I do not know the BAT structure. So it's hard to tell me something constructive, something I do not use. I operate on 4.12+ModAct5.30+EngineModv2.7+million mods+planes I War+planes II War+dryers (Jet Era). I install everything alone, I correct entries, I am in the order of Class File. For me everything works like in the "Swiss watch". We will ask someone who knows the structure of BAT is someone? whet.her only everyone is taking  ;D
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 27, 2021, 07:59:38 AM
As far as I understand, BAT 4.0 uses Engine Mod 2.7, and is built on 4.12.2. Based on that, I shouldn't expect incompatibilities.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Fulmen on October 27, 2021, 12:12:03 PM
that thread has 145 pages :) could you provide a download-link maybe?

Hi Griffon_301
OK. After this time I do not remember where the page number was. Two cups of coffee later  :)
http://forum.aviaskins.com/showthread.php?t=2949&page=100

This looks very, very interesting, thank you!

Btw speaking of the plane's flight model, I had forgotten that the plane also flies considerably slower than the real thing. Hopefully Vasya has fixed this. I will test his work immediately.

Also WxTech, I have a treat for you: much better photos of the cockpit than the ones I posted previously, kindly provided to me by LLv34_Untamo. I included a few other photos that are relevant to modelling the cockpit in general, not just the instruments. I uploaded them to Mediafire this time because there's so many of them and this forum downsizes them a little. I tried Imgur but it also cut the quality a bit. Here: https://www.mediafire.com/file/kepuq3e7nzcckgb/Photos.zip/file
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 27, 2021, 02:25:56 PM
As far as I understand, BAT 4.0 uses Engine Mod 2.7, and is built on 4.12.2. Based on that, I shouldn't expect incompatibilities.
Hi WxTech
I am writing a late but I just came back home. Attempt the cockpit mod and mod fm vasya inherit the same cockpit classes. Are you absolutely sure that these classes
32D6D860570A8AF6
C572203C06B0C572
F65A54BC5D461E02
F668394AA1662B60
The first FM mode load first. This is in my installation and works tip-top
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 27, 2021, 06:28:50 PM
As far as I understand, BAT 4.0 uses Engine Mod 2.7, and is built on 4.12.2. Based on that, I shouldn't expect incompatibilities.
Hi WxTech
I am writing a late but I just came back home. Attempt the cockpit mod and mod fm vasya inherit the same cockpit classes. Are you absolutely sure that these classes
32D6D860570A8AF6
C572203C06B0C572
F65A54BC5D461E02
F668394AA1662B60
The first FM mode load first. This is in my installation and works tip-top

Those classes aren't present. I do have 9 other classes, which are for 5 plane classes (3 F2A and 2 A6M) and 4 gun classes.

Was there more than one version of the mod available? I grabbed what looked to be correct....

Thanks!
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 27, 2021, 06:35:29 PM
Ah, I see a pair of additional links in the last post on that page; one for 4.12.2 and another for 4.13.4. Just grabbed both. Will be trying shortly...
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 27, 2021, 07:21:47 PM
Fulmen,
I checked out that little collection of photos; wonderful stuff! Thanks. You know what they say about gift horses, but it would have been nice to have a pic or two showing details of the canopy frame construction. We enthusiasts tend to concentrate on the instruments, but an important aspect of a sim is the canopy, as that's what we have to look through into the outside world.

But this stuff is invaluable, so I'll stop my moaning now.  ;)

Cheers!
Glenn
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 27, 2021, 07:59:35 PM
As far as I understand, BAT 4.0 uses Engine Mod 2.7, and is built on 4.12.2. Based on that, I shouldn't expect incompatibilities.
Hi WxTech
I am writing a late but I just came back home. Attempt the cockpit mod and mod fm vasya inherit the same cockpit classes. Are you absolutely sure that these classes
32D6D860570A8AF6
C572203C06B0C572
F65A54BC5D461E02
F668394AA1662B60
The first FM mode load first. This is in my installation and works tip-top

I installed the 4.12.2 version of Vasya's mod, which I presume to be compatible with BAT 4.0. The mod is read before anything else B-239 related. But I still don't have the LKk42 gun option in the loadout menu; only "empty" and "default".

I looked over the cockpit.class Java, and see the same tachometer adjustment I recently discovered as needing to be done, but with a new wrinkle; a check on whether the RPM is less than 1000, for which a different gauge scaling applies. Other than that, I see nothing that would necessitate these 4 classes *having* to be present...
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: ben_wh on October 27, 2021, 08:12:18 PM
WxTech,

If I remember correctly, there is a version of the LKK42 MGun classes in this mod:  https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,63051.msg733326.html#msg733326


Cheers,
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 27, 2021, 08:38:48 PM
ben_wh,
Thanks for chiming in. In both versions of Vasya's mod the LKk42 gun classes are present. And the plane class has the loadout option present.

It seems at least the motor aspects of the mod are working, as the tachometer needle's range is clearly different now. And I know these cockpit classfiles are being used due to the stock compass behaviour and more restricted 6dof ranges, compared to my fixed classfiles. But not having the gun loadout option available is stumping me.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: cestode on October 27, 2021, 10:42:30 PM
I'm looking forward to the results of this! When you guys are finished, would it be possible to include instructions for a beginner to install everything? The instructions for the cockpit tweaks were clear, but the flight model stuff is way over my head.

Also, when BAT gets the next upgrade would all of these changes get lost from my installation? Would I need to install these tweaks all over again?
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 28, 2021, 12:01:16 AM
But dear gentlemen, historically the LKk - 42 (Browning clone) appeared later than the Buffaloes themselves in Finladia. I would like to add that it was not a successful construction, cracking the barrel. And we have it included in the modification B-239-63. LKk-42 were used in Buffalo and Curtiss Hawk 75, which were in service in Finland in the later stages of the war. and here the author of the modification has kept the historical reference.

(https://images91.fotosik.pl/548/3898e4c561fcdee2.jpg)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 12:20:38 AM
There is an additional oddity around the B-239 in my BAT 4.0 install. And that is that while the default skin in the preview window shows a nice green camo paint job, the actual skin that the plane wears at mission start is a completely different metal skin that looks so out of place. So, I suffer a couple strange issues, it would seem.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 28, 2021, 12:23:28 AM


[/quote]

Other than that, I see nothing that would necessitate these 4 classes *having* to be present...
[/quote]

I will not agree on this. In my installation it was essential for the mod to work properly. Anyway, the fact that BAT has a backbone from 4.12 + modact + engine mod does not mean that it will work similarly.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 12:29:26 AM
I'm looking forward to the results of this! When you guys are finished, would it be possible to include instructions for a beginner to install everything? The instructions for the cockpit tweaks were clear, but the flight model stuff is way over my head.

Also, when BAT gets the next upgrade would all of these changes get lost from my installation? Would I need to install these tweaks all over again?

I'm not sure about packing in the FM mod with my revamped cockpit. It might be poor form due to a separation from the author who might do further work on it down the road. Disparate mods by different authors might best be left under the care and maintenance of their creators.

In any event, the FM mod is installed as easily as any other mod.

As to what gets included in BAT updates, that's up to the BAT developers. And that depends on the quality of the mod, and how well integrated it is, and the degree of internal consistency and that there are no potential points of failure or conflict.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 28, 2021, 12:29:55 AM
Not only that. Even with an assimilation like 4.12 with mod act and engine mod there are problems. Example? ... GearDamage in 4.12, same class in engine mod and effect distorted, only after giving the original files a high hierarchy, the effect appears as it should.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 28, 2021, 02:25:27 AM
I know BAT has many favorable opinions. It's a complex organism, and I'm taking my hat off my head before the authors do. However, my philosophy is different.
Uno-I only want what I need, no extra inventory. 200 other planes.
Secundo-I want to have full control and knowledge of what I have installed, what-for-what-and why.
Anyway, gentlemen, the discussion takes place in the section "Individual Mod Downloads for IL-2 1946" not "BAT"
For now, I'm still working on new cockpit textures  ;D
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 02:28:54 AM
OK, so I just added the air.ini entry from the file, A6M2-AM+F2A_B239_M63--TEST.txt, and now I see the LKk42 gun loadout when I select the newly added M63 plane version. When I saw the "TEST" in the file name, I thought it was some irrelevant file accidentally left in place.  ;)

But now I'm a bit in doubt of the new FM being utilized. I've ascertained that the different tachometer response is only due to the code for that gauge as set in the cockpit class, after swapping out my own class file in the testing process. Furthermore, it looks like the LKk42 gun should be using the included MG_BredaSAFAT127 sound files, which are very different from the sounds for the Browning 50. But I'm still hearing the latter sound.

In the past, when installing new planes that had their own FM, I recall that it was required to have the FM file located in the mod's root folder (where classfiles must reside). Is this no longer the case?


Note that I've named this mod folder with a preceding "!!0_", and so it sits in 4th place from the top of the folder listing, with absolutely nothing present in those higher folders which could possibly cause a conflict.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 02:42:27 AM
I know BAT has many favorable opinions. It's a complex organism, and I'm taking my hat off my head before the authors do. However, my philosophy is different.
Uno-I only want what I need, no extra inventory. 200 other planes.
Secundo-I want to have full control and knowledge of what I have installed, what-for-what-and why.
Anyway, gentlemen, the discussion takes place in the section "Individual Mod Downloads for IL-2 1946" not "BAT"
For now, I'm still working on new cockpit textures  ;D

I too am a control freak! For one thing, I've never used JSGME. For another, if the option exists, I prefer a completely manual install of every file into its rightful place. Even for maps, I assiduously move over every file, being certain that I'm not overwriting anything. If there are conflicts, I'll rename files or create new folders as necessary and where feasible, altering the files that point to them, of course.

In the context of this discussion, BAT 4.0 is fundamentally 4.12.2 with the Engine Mod 2.7 incorporated. I guess the question is this; does the Engine Mod cause an incompatibility here?

And I might add... This is MY thread and I'll tolerate what might nominally be called 'out of bounds' subject matter. Or else I'll take my ball and go home!   :baby_banana:
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 28, 2021, 03:13:46 AM
WxTech  :D
Your stick is weak  ;) , I use the 5.56 caliber argument on a daily basis  :D
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 04:48:36 AM
So I think I tracked down the problem. I still had the earlier version of the FM mod present, its folder disabled with a preceding "-" character. But it seems class files can still be read if present in such supposedly disabled folders. After cleaning out all but the one, latest mod, I now know for certain that the new FM is working, I have the proper sound for the LKk42 gun, and the default skin is showing up when I enter a mission.

All is right with the Universe.


I also added to the cockpit class my differentiation between the gyro and magnetic compasses. Both were always treated as identical, where the gyro had the same lag in response and the same 30 degree bank angle limit as for the magnetic compass. Bad. Gyros are instantly and crisply responsive, and I made this one much more quick to respond. And I removed that 30 degree bank angle limit for the gyro as well.

But I need to apply further compass fixes, because the code is the old crude treatment, which causes the violent swing of the card whenever the plane's azimuth passes through 270 degrees. (Gods, but does that annoy the hell outta me!) And I might add a tilting action to the magnetic compass as the plane banks and pitches.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Repetier_71 on October 28, 2021, 05:02:31 AM
I also confirm from experience that class files even with a sign "-" somehow can be read. Someone here is here on SAS once signaled that there may happen there. In the case of "Silver Skin" I asked Vasya's or can check whether this class files mix something. If not, you will have to look for a different reason, because one problem will do two and two problems will make eight  ;D
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 05:42:10 AM
I thought I was now getting the default skin, because the overall color is much the same. But I discovered that's not the case. The preview shows what is supposed to be the default, but in a mission the actual skin is clearly different from what's shown in the preview. And not only that, it's not like anything I have in my skin folder. Strange...

Is it really possible that a classfile renamed with a preceding "-" character can still be recognized and thus read? I thought that the different name would instantly preclude its being recognized. The only way this could occur is if the code parsing the names for hashed classes explicitly looked for the presence of a preceding "-" and strip it in the process of parsing. That would be a dangerous practice, for hashed classes only get that "-" when it is desired to nullify them; it doesn't tend to happen by 'accident.'

In any event, classes definitely require great care in their handling.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: SAS~vampire_pilot on October 28, 2021, 05:52:04 AM
You might have to check the contents of the java class, WxTech. Is the FM correctly referenced that you want?

Also, please note that in BAT you cannot modify a loadout list with java entries in that slot. It has to be with a cod file or you have to enter a method in the class that tells it to explicitly ignore the cod and take the java entries instead.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 06:07:08 AM
Vamps,
Yep, the FM is correctly referenced. And there is included a cod file. Things seem to be working fine now, except for the weird default skin business.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: SAS~vampire_pilot on October 28, 2021, 06:14:13 AM
it could be a multi-nation plane with multiple summer, winter, PTO, desert.... default skins. So you have to take into account that your map may not reference what you may think.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: marcost on October 28, 2021, 07:02:58 AM
Having recently converted to BAT and experienced issues with iteration folders in my mod class folders being read (never were before), I suspect the issue with reading '-' files has something to do with the changes that were made to allow unhashed classfiles to be read in mod folders.

Regards,

M
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 07:21:25 AM
About the skin business. In this mod of Vasya's, in F2A_B239.class there's this:

Code: [Select]
    public static String getSkinPrefix(String s, Regiment regiment)
    {
        if(regiment == null || regiment.country() == null)
            return "";
        if(regiment.country().equals("fi"))
        {
            int i = Mission.getMissionDate(true);
            if(i > 0)
            {
                if(i < 0x1282df2)
                    return "winterwar_";
                if(i < 0x1282fd5)
                    return "early_";
            }
        }
        return "";
    }

It appears that if the country being flown for is Finland, the mission date determines a prefix to look for and select a skin from...
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 07:45:34 AM
Indeed, for other countries I'm flying for the default as seen in the preview is the one I get when in the mission. Only for Finland is this buggered.

There used to be a conf.ini entry called ClearCache=0 or 1. When not set to clear, one could load a plane, and whatever skin clothing it would be available in the Skins cache. I'd like to be able to grab some default skins and make them part of my set. But in BAT the only thing that shows up in the cache are .mat files.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Griffon_301 on October 28, 2021, 08:56:12 AM
But then AFAIK the Finnish Brewster's were delivered in natural metal with just national insignia on them but no camo....
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: SAS~vampire_pilot on October 28, 2021, 09:44:52 AM
Having recently converted to BAT and experienced issues with iteration folders in my mod class folders being read (never were before), I suspect the issue with reading '-' files has something to do with the changes that were made to allow unhashed classfiles to be read in mod folders.

The fact that unhashed classes can be used (same hierarchy principles apply!) is not new!
It's been possible for years already.

Just the fact the we actually do it in public is new :)


There used to be a conf.ini entry called ClearCache=0 or 1. When not set to clear, one could load a plane, and whatever skin clothing it would be available in the Skins cache. I'd like to be able to grab some default skins and make them part of my set. But in BAT the only thing that shows up in the cache are .mat files.

Perfectly possible in BAT. It's how I work myself.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 10:04:01 AM
Vamps,
I added the ClearCache item to the [Game] section of conf.ini, but after re-starting that entry disappeared upon conf.ini  being re-written. I had assumed it was no longer supported, and didn't bother to check the cache. But your indication that it was indeed supported inspired me to look again, and lo and behold; a folder was present containing the 4 skin files.

Another little issue conquered!
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Fulmen on October 28, 2021, 11:37:27 AM
Fulmen,
I checked out that little collection of photos; wonderful stuff! Thanks. You know what they say about gift horses, but it would have been nice to have a pic or two showing details of the canopy frame construction. We enthusiasts tend to concentrate on the instruments, but an important aspect of a sim is the canopy, as that's what we have to look through into the outside world.

But this stuff is invaluable, so I'll stop my moaning now.  ;)

Cheers!
Glenn

I'll PM you.

Some observations from limited testing of Vasya's FM for the B-239. Also I ran the mod on BAT and first with WxTech's rework installed as well, and then without the latter because its tachometer rework was overwriting Vasya's tachometer.

+The tachometer seems to be around what it should be. I think it might show a tiny amount too much RPM at higher altitudes? Might also be a flight model issue. WxTech's fix is still off by quite a lot more; recommend using Vasya's fix.

+The supercharger seems to behave more realistically. IRL you needed to switch it at 3,000 m, not 2,000-2,500 like in the game before.

+The aircraft seems to be about as fast as it should be.

+The aircraft is noticeably more agile, might still need to be even a little more agile but this would require looking at data and doing some more elaborate testing to ascertain.

-The speed gauge seems to be far too accurate. Just now whilst testing at 5,000 altitude I had an IAS of almost 410 km/h and my TAS was 421 km/h. IRL in a test with BW-356 on 10.8.1943 with full power at 5,000 m at 2,100 RPM and 90 cmHg manifold pressure IAS was 332 km/h while TAS in standard atmosphere was 461 km/h. At 3,000 m with the same aircraft IAS was 332 km/h when TAS was 429 km/h. Also at least when using BAT in WxTech's rework the gauge is currently all over the place. I think this was a result of BAT having already adjusted the gauge?

A couple of notes here as well: I had to disable NG-HUD to get accurate TAS from the HUD in "no cockpit" mode, as NG-HUD replaces this with IAS... Furthermore the IAS shown in the lower bottom-left corner by both the vanilla HUD and NG-HUD is not what the speed gauge in the cockpit displays, generally it's far from it.

The desired outcome here is that cockpit IAS matches with HUD IAS, and that the error with IAS in relation to TAS matches with the real-life IAS-to-TAS error.

-If I'm reading the manifold pressure gauge right, it's wrong in all versions. EDIT: No wonder, the in-game manifold pressure gauge is completely wrong; it's a 0-50 inHg one, where as the real one was 0-120 cmHg.

-RPM decrease from overly rich fuel mixture is not modelled, only the decrease from too lean a mixture is.

-Damage from leaning mixture too fast and at the wrong temperatures is not modelled. Haven't actually tested what happens if you run WEP for too long. I have a suspicion that it may not destroy the engine like it should, but this needs to be tested.

But dear gentlemen, historically the LKk - 42 (Browning clone) appeared later than the Buffaloes themselves in Finladia. I would like to add that it was not a successful construction, cracking the barrel. And we have it included in the modification B-239-63. LKk-42 were used in Buffalo and Curtiss Hawk 75, which were in service in Finland in the later stages of the war. and here the author of the modification has kept the historical reference.

(https://images91.fotosik.pl/548/3898e4c561fcdee2.jpg)

The VKT's (State Rifle Factory) 12.7 mm LKk/42 (Aircraft Machine gun model 1942) was installed on the wings of five Brewsters in total. It was tested in the autumn of 1943 on BW-382 with good results and during the winter of 1943-44 four other Brewsters received gun as well: BW-373, 377, 384 and 386. It could not be installed on the fuselage, because the charging mechanism was too heavy to be operated by hand by the pilots.

But then AFAIK the Finnish Brewster's were delivered in natural metal with just national insignia on them but no camo....

They were delivered in parts and assembled in Sweden and then flown to Finland, where FAF insignia was painted on them. They arrived in Finland looking like this:

(https://i.postimg.cc/Hs7wFtVx/Naked-Brewsters.png) (https://postimg.cc/2VrLZhdR)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 01:03:18 PM
Fulmen,
The Vasya tachometer code is 'bi-modal', with one scaling applied when RPM is <1000, and another scaling when above. I've adopted that.

My airspeed code uses fm.getSpeedKMH(), which I selected to make scaling to the metric ASI gauge straightforward. The stock (and Vasya's) code uses fm.getSpeed(). I don't know if there is a difference between these methods in theirhandling of indicated vs true airspeed...

I've integrated my compass changes into Vasya's cockpit class for 4.12.2, and will shortly post it. This is OK certainly up to BAT 4.1.1, and possibly for any BAT 4.1.x. For BAT 4.2, I don't know for certain if the 4.13.4 version is OK; I'll see about tweaking it as well.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 01:19:19 PM
I should add this.

The stock airspeed code scales such that for speeds between 0 and 41.15554, the needle moves between 0 and 30 degrees. For speeds between 41.15554 and 246.9333, the needle sweeps from 30 to 340 degrees.

Note that the 246.9333 value is a hard limit, I believe, meaning the needle will stop there at 340 degrees on the dial, even if the speed exceeds this. I'm assuming the units are m/s, which when doubled roughly corresponds to kt. Meaning the limit on needle response would be roughly 500 kt.

I elected to have the airspeed output in km/h, scaled such that 0-100 km/h occupies the range 0-47 degrees, and 100-750 km/h occupies the range 47-544 degrees. Suitable for the VSI gauge I use. (I measured the angles on the gauge texture, and found a nice linearity from 100 km/h and up.)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: Fulmen on October 28, 2021, 03:14:39 PM
I should add this.

The stock airspeed code scales such that for speeds between 0 and 41.15554, the needle moves between 0 and 30 degrees. For speeds between 41.15554 and 246.9333, the needle sweeps from 30 to 340 degrees.

Note that the 246.9333 value is a hard limit, I believe, meaning the needle will stop there at 340 degrees on the dial, even if the speed exceeds this. I'm assuming the units are m/s, which when doubled roughly corresponds to kt. Meaning the limit on needle response would be roughly 500 kt.

I elected to have the airspeed output in km/h, scaled such that 0-100 km/h occupies the range 0-47 degrees, and 100-750 km/h occupies the range 47-544 degrees. Suitable for the VSI gauge I use. (I measured the angles on the gauge texture, and found a nice linearity from 100 km/h and up.)

The game actually uses the wrong airspeed indicator on the B-239.

It uses a 0-500 mph 1403-4J-D1 Type D-6 Pioneer:

(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/80/71/46/807146eb11becab6cf8d375bb6ec85ce.jpg)

https://aeroantique.com/products/airspeed-indicator-500-mph-bendix-1403-4j-d1-type-d-6?variant=20245156560985 (https://aeroantique.com/products/airspeed-indicator-500-mph-bendix-1403-4j-d1-type-d-6?variant=20245156560985)

What it should use is a 0-800 kmh Pioneer (the exact model is not mentioned in the papers and literature I have):

(https://i.postimg.cc/sgzmFD1q/B-239-Airspeed-Indicator.png) (https://postimages.org/)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 28, 2021, 03:33:50 PM
That's why I supply a metric ASI with my wee mod, and the code driving the needle scaled to suit.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 29, 2021, 06:38:34 AM
I've been re-building the instrument panel. The existing one is a single surface, which due to the transparency layer for the instrument hole cut-outs, allows the Sun to be seen through those parts of it not having 'solid' polygons behind.

An excellent example of this problem on a more egregious level is seen for the Bf-109. Almost the whole panel, and the cockpit framing bars, permit the Sun to shine through. Any polygons which are to provide opacity against this occurring MUST NOT have an alpha channel.

And so my panel has such an opaque plate, and the stamped 'beauty' panel cover is its own surface floating 6mm in front of the opaque plate. The gauges and needles will reside between, appearing through the transparency cut-out holes in the 'beauty' panel.

The entire canopy is to be built anew. As is the after cabin, with currently missing framing arches put in, and the 'roll bar quadrupod' (don't know what else to call it  ;)  ) and armor plate. For instance, the peak of the quadrupod in reality leans forward, where currently it is simply perpendicular to 'cockpit level'.

For the gauges, I might add dynamically lighted glass covers in the way I did so for the P-39. In short, modelers tend to let the design software orient the surface normals perpendicular to vertices and surfaces. In certain circumstances this is not appropriate. In the case of glass reflection intensity, it is strongest when whatever is reflected is most strongly illuminated. What do gauge glass covers reflect? When the look angle toward these covers is generally downward, they reflect stuff inside the 'pit, not often the outside world. And when is the 'pit interior most brightly lit? When the Sun shines in from above, and perhaps a bit forward. Therefore the usual perpendicular surface normals, directed rearward, are not valid. Here the normals should be directed toward that place where the Sun shines from so as to most brightly light the cockpit; up and a bit forward.

My dynamically lit collimating lens reflection present in a number of my other 'pit mods (and will be added here), takes the same approach. The texture faces the pilot, but the surface normals point straight up. More accurately, from the 4 corners of the texture the normals fan out, so as to make the reflection intensity dynamically vary across its face as the illumination source (Sun) direction varies.

My P-39 cockpit illustrates these glass related effects nicely.

I might continue to post development updates here. But to be sure, this new mod will be given its own thread, because it's a make-over on a whole new level compared to the quick 'n dirty llittle tweaks performed in this current, interim iteration.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on October 29, 2021, 11:01:10 AM
Assuming the overall panel dimensions are correct, from a proportionality standpoint the gauge faces are currently a bit undersized. (I haven't yet got round to determining the actual gauge texture sizing from the panel mesh.) Particularly so for the artificial horizon, which is roughly 120% larger than the bulk of the others. Specifically, the circular opening through which the cylindrical drum and horizon bar are seen is about as large as the full window of the most common standard gage face, with the surrounding annulus upon which are painted the fiducial ticks and numbers extending the total face diameter. Having the Sperry artificial horizon's face the same size as that for, e.g., the ASI, turn 'n bank and VSI just looks so wrong.
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: SAS~vampire_pilot on November 23, 2021, 11:57:29 PM
Hey WxTech,

are you still working on this one?
How "finished" is that last download version?
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: WxTech on November 24, 2021, 02:06:27 AM
Still lots of work to do to achieve a satisfying conclusion. It could be a couple weeks or so, depending on how resistant I am against various distractions. I'm on the cusp of re-issuing my effects pack, after having touched up hundreds of files.

The  current state of the B-239 is certainly well shy of my ultimate aims. I want the kind of upgrade I obtained for my Wildcat 'pit. But as it is right now is something of a wee boost.  ;)  Do I take it that a BAT update is in the offing?
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: SAS~vampire_pilot on November 24, 2021, 02:25:25 AM
yeah, let's say I am looking around ;)
Title: Re: WxTech's F2A-1 (B-239) Cockpit Tweaks
Post by: PO_MAK_249RIP on November 26, 2021, 04:33:14 AM
A lovely Xmas present in store I suspect?? LOL