Special Aircraft Service

the SAS Hangar => The Lounge => Topic started by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 02:27:59 AM

Title: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 02:27:59 AM
So, the two owners of the forum and all round good guys, Piet and Mike, aka "Those Assholes from SAS", spent a week together in SA over these holidays and had some fun, also exchanged some tips and tricks, both from the past and for the future.  ]cheers[

We decided that we should post at least some pictures in public to prove that this meeting really did take place :)

So in this thread I shall do so. Here are two pics, and a few more will follow. Enjoy!

(https://i.postimg.cc/13XvmyyB/2020mike1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/v4RrXFgx)


(https://i.postimg.cc/7LW6FMmX/2020mike2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/kVWq88rt)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 12, 2020, 02:36:58 AM
It's been a really great time down in SA as you will see.
We've seen things and done things that others wouldn't even dare to dream of.
Pretty cool stuff, definitely one of the greatest weeks I've ever had.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Mission_bug on January 12, 2020, 02:43:41 AM
Good to know you guys have met and enjoyed the experience, may your friendship long continue. 8)

It is also good to put faces to names finally and see you both as you are. ;)

Take care.

Wishing you all the very best, Pete. ;D
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 02:55:00 AM
For those who may wonder where the "Schwarte Piet" avatar comes from:

(https://i.postimg.cc/52h184N9/IMG-4211.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/G4xZC1y6)

The T-34, undoubtedly the IL-2 of tanks

(https://i.postimg.cc/RVWjdkYW/2018-01-01-029.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/fJh2TrDs)

The AK47, undoubtedly the T-34 of rifles (and an AR15 on the left to restore balance to the force lol)

(https://i.postimg.cc/YqLsY14g/2020rifles.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/svymRG4D)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 02:56:43 AM
from up in space

(https://i.postimg.cc/Ss5wbV2S/2020robotsandufos.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/4768z6Qq)

to under the earth

(https://i.postimg.cc/BbTN7C2w/2020sterkfontein.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Wq4MhgWM)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 02:58:32 AM
in one place we found a cow that had sunk into the ground

(https://i.postimg.cc/3RCDPfbp/2020mike3.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/dk31C6Ft)

and later that day, on the other side of the city, we found the place where it is emerging

(https://i.postimg.cc/65ST1N5g/2020mike4.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/PPWtP9DQ)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 03:01:08 AM
Our transport

(https://i.postimg.cc/x1vYyrkK/2020dak1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/RWZj4DLF)

The top of the world...

(https://i.postimg.cc/Vv0PJ2Q0/2020cradle.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/H8mhKZLT)

...and the top of Pretoria . Some people still think it is the same thing :D

(https://i.postimg.cc/YSXSYcVd/2020pretoria.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/xkzYVZ9m)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 03:03:15 AM
The Ruger GP100, undoubtedly the IL-2 of revolvers :D

(https://i.postimg.cc/cHp0BdcB/2020rev.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/Hc9qpDRr)

Mike and Wild Mary. They decapitated and disemboweled this target from a distance.

(https://i.postimg.cc/FHH5cf4Q/2020wildmary.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/xch4V18s)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 03:06:43 AM
The entire crew, with Zebra in the road who refused to move

(https://i.postimg.cc/wM24TV3R/2018-01-01-018.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/8fFmZLRT)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 03:08:23 AM
just for interest, IL2 v0.9 :

(https://i.postimg.cc/FHTfgJkb/2020il2v1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/yDSY7xPW)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 03:10:29 AM
Small Cockpits:

(https://i.postimg.cc/sfPg4ZtB/2020research.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/dD1FqDQv)

Medium Cockpits:

(https://i.postimg.cc/mgK4sbvf/2020gloves.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/K17w7ycJ)

Awesome Cockpits:

(https://i.postimg.cc/PJ59DcgQ/2020sasrules2.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/2bg0RH81)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 12, 2020, 03:13:31 AM
One more pic of the last scene, for those who know the history of this plane, and of this mod, and of the two guys in it :)
Glynn, we missed you here buddy!

If anyone in the world is still in doubt about what forum of IL2 modders rocks the most, the longest, and the hardest, this should settle it  ]cheers[

Salutes to all!

(https://i.postimg.cc/9FRVNRkt/202-SASrules1.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/6yXD83ty)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: henkypenky on January 12, 2020, 03:14:58 AM
Nice serie guys, you are some lucky bastards sitting in those cockpits! Have fun.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Gaston on January 12, 2020, 03:16:55 AM
Nice !
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 12, 2020, 03:36:59 AM
One week, no limits.
Note the signs.

(https://i.ibb.co/YthPJJg/IMG-4198.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/C5nh18d/IMG-4745.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: shahryar on January 12, 2020, 05:31:24 AM
Nice pics, really enjoying watching them. thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: BalDaddy on January 12, 2020, 07:34:29 AM
Great shots of 'Men doing Manly Things! :)
Great Mancave you have there too.
Which military museum is that shown please?
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 12, 2020, 07:56:54 AM
Which military museum is that shown please?

(https://i.ibb.co/B4r5H0J/IMG-3995.jpg)

Mike and Wild Mary. They decapitated and disemboweled this target from a distance.

Guess who started it ]laughing7[

(https://i.ibb.co/qJtxMGC/IMG-4702.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: GJE52 on January 12, 2020, 03:26:10 PM
Great pics ... looks like you guys had a whole world of fun.

....... Piet, your games room is even more disorganised than mine......... Did I really see what I thought I saw on your computer screen ........ ? ;)  :D :D :D :D. bad, bad boys...

One day, who knows, I might get to sit in that particular and very special Me 262 cockpit.  ;). either seat will be just fine  ;D

Thanks for sharing your memories with us.

love you guys... in a manly way of course... :-*

G;
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Knochenlutscher on January 12, 2020, 03:49:09 PM
Good to see you active on your Freetime duty.
Looks like fun.
Enjoy your days and greetings from Halle

Tobias
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 13, 2020, 10:28:44 PM
Time for a little bit of engine porn.
If you know me, you will also know that I'm absolutely excited about engines (and not into cars at all, just saying...).

(https://i.ibb.co/2ZpnTmQ/IMG-4030.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/6n9Xvfm/IMG-4033.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/FqSVjJp/IMG-4036.jpg)

Top image is Piet explaining what special thing we actually see here.
Which doesn't mean which type of engine, that's a given... take it as a quest ;)
And: Yes, we did indeed remove that engine cover ourselves.
Much to the surprise (and shock maybe) of other visitors, not so much to David's surprise. He has already figured that we're serious guys at that point.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: BlackAce7727 on January 13, 2020, 10:43:00 PM
Amazing shots as well as memories for you both! Forever friends as well as being aces!  8) ^-^
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Gerax on January 14, 2020, 03:13:11 AM
Great pics guys, really like them!  ;D

I'm pretty sure you had a lot of fun ..  ;)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 14, 2020, 06:57:19 AM
the thing in the 262 engine looks like the starter motor for it, a bit like a primitive APU
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 14, 2020, 07:15:04 AM
Absolutely. It's actually a small 2-stroke engine itself.

Here by the way Prof. Dr. Piet explains the inner details of the Me-262's gunsight to David:

(https://i.ibb.co/tXhwFcx/IMG-4062.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/4N5WnRZ/IMG-4058.jpg)

And this is unworthy me, climbing that sweet Kraut Dreams cockpit:

(https://i.ibb.co/zGjG00Q/IMG-4071.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 14, 2020, 07:49:47 AM
the 262 looks like its in really nice shape even the safety wire is still in place, was it restored? or original?
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 14, 2020, 07:53:31 AM
https://youtu.be/BGUqV0dl9gA
262 starter motor in action
pretty much  a weed eater motor
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 14, 2020, 10:38:04 AM
Might I just mention that all our access was requested, discussed and granted ahead of time, based on past experience with these specific planes and relationships with the museum, and supervised at all times by the curators of the museum, in this instance David, who can be seen in some of the pictures.

....... Piet, your games room is even more disorganised than mine......... Did I really see what I thought I saw on your computer screen ........ ? ;)  :D :D :D :D. bad, bad boys...

you saw nothing.  :-X

the 262 looks like its in really nice shape even the safety wire is still in place, was it restored? or original?

Inside it is untouched. The engines as you can see still in red wax applied for shipping, and the cockpit still bears hand written notes from the last allied pilots who tested this back after the end of WW2.

The outside of the plane was restored to the current historically accurate scheme (as it might have appeared in-service) following the captured and later markings that were applied post war.

The plane's name is Ursula. :)

Some very detailed photographs of her in this book, written by some weird people long ago  :D

https://www.aviationmegastore.com/messerschmitt-me262a-b--avia-s92-cs92-ht915-ht-model-ht915-ww2-german-aircraft/product/?action=prodinfo&art=77909


(https://i.postimg.cc/rFJ6nTgG/77909-0.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)

 ]cheers[
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 14, 2020, 11:20:14 PM
all our access was requested, discussed and granted ahead of time, based on past experience with these specific planes and relationships with the museum, and supervised at all times by the curators of the museum
Good point.
That's exactly what counts: Let the right people talk to the right people.
Morons won't get into the planes.
If you are a moron yourself (*wink*) and dream of getting into such aircraft: Forget it.

you saw nothing.  :-X

(https://i.ibb.co/wsLCWTD/nothing-to-see-here-naked-gun-797455.gif)

this book, written by some weird people long ago

This!

(https://i.ibb.co/B60Y4s8/20200115-071339.jpg)

Thanks a bomb Piet!

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 15, 2020, 11:11:48 PM
Some more engine porn and an unfortunately slightly crippled Dakota pit:

(https://i.ibb.co/hCZX8Kh/IMG-4229.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/dmr5WGw/IMG-4138.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 16, 2020, 06:20:00 AM
BMW 801 is the motor but its got a hole in the spinner?
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 16, 2020, 06:52:16 AM
Yes indeed, it's got a hole in the spinner.
Opinions differ concerning the reason:
Wikipedia (source: Caygill, Peter. Combat Legend Focke-wulf Fw 190. Ramsbury, UK: Airlife Publishing Limited, 2002, ISBN 978-1-84037-366-0) says "A small hole in the centre of the spinner also directed airflow to ancillary components."
Richard Wittmann and Werner Molge say "it's been for maintenance".

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 16, 2020, 07:29:45 AM
i know a lot of American aircraft had the starter in the spinners not sure about the German radials tho
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 16, 2020, 08:13:11 AM
The starter in the spinners?
German engines use flywheel starters usually.
It's quite unlikely that the hole is related to them.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: <Gunny> on January 16, 2020, 08:21:39 AM
This is a great post . I really enjoy the pictures of the planes and pits....
 ]wav[
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 16, 2020, 09:24:55 AM
right thats what i figured, still a cool plane it does look like the BMW emblem is missing from the bottom of the motor tho, that because BMW wanted to distance themselves from the Nazis maybe? and whats the Dakotas story?
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: UberDemon on January 16, 2020, 10:17:40 PM
Man,

That is awesome!  I have never met any of the IL-2 mates in person...  Maybe some day.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 18, 2020, 09:10:09 AM
whats the Dakotas story?

The perfect outline of that particular Dakota's history can be found here: http://samilitaryhistory.org/vol146as.html

Quote
The Museum's Dakota No 6850

The Museum's new acquisition, No 6850, was built in the United States of America in 1944 by the Douglas Aircraft Corporation at Oklahoma City as part of Contract No AC40652. Shortly after completion, it was delivered to the United States Army Air Force with the serial number 43-49838 and painted in the standard Olive Drab/Neutral Grey of the USAAF.

On 18 January 1945 the aircraft was diverted to the Royal Air Force under the Lend-Lease Agreement as an RAF Dakota Mk IV with the serial number KN231. It was assigned to Air Command, South East Asia and delivered to India in March 1945 as part of a batch of 30 Dakota Mk IVs. There it remained in service until the end of the war, flying supplies over the 'hump' between India and China. Throughout this period, the aircraft served with Nos 31, 52 and 353 Squadrons, RAF, and, in 1949, it was still in service with No 48 Squadron, based at RAF Changi. In November 1951, the aircraft was returned to the United Kingdom and delivered to No 22 Maintenance Unit for storage and disposal.

In May 1953 the aircraft was sold to Airwork Ltd where it was converted to a Civilian Dakota Mk III and allocated the serial number G-AMZW. Two months later, Airwork Ltd sold the aircraft to Sudan Airways where it was registered as SN-AAH, later changed to ST-AAH. The aircraft remained in service with Sudan Airways until October 1965, when it was transferred to the Sudan Air Force with the serial number 424 after undergoing a thorough overhaul carried out by Scottish Aviation. This transfer did not last long; it was handed back to Sudan Airways in July 1967.

(https://i.postimg.cc/bJrnWYRQ/vo146ase.jpg)
The veteran C-47 Dakota aircraft, No 6850, now on display at the
South African National Museum of Military History, Erlswold Way, Saxonwold,
Johannesburg, has come a long way since its Second World War service,
flying supplies over the 'hump' in South-East Asia.

On 17 May 1975, the aircraft arrived at Jan Smuts International Airport (now OR Tambo International) in Johannesburg, still painted in its Sudan Airways livery. It is uncertain how and why the aircraft came to this country from the Sudan. Immediately after arrival, it was sent to No 1 Aircraft Servicing Unit for paint stripping, before being taken on charge by the South African Air Force in August of that year with the serial number 6850, still configured as a Civilian Mk III, but with engine numbers 10314 and 12592. The aircraft was to be the second Dakota to be allocated that particular serial number, the original 6850 having crashed at AFB Swartkop in August 1972.

In 1976, No 6850 was given a complete overhaul at the SMF Field Aircraft Services and it was later modified to SMF standards 'at Snake Valley. On 18 May 1977, it was issued to No 44 Squadron at AFB Swartkop for deployment in the photo-reconnaissance/survey role. The engine numbers allocated at that stage were 10314 and 359680.

During the early 1980s, the aircraft underwent a conversion back to Mk IV status to improve performance. At that time, Project Algebra was initiated in which it was equipped with an electronic visual reconnaissance system with an approximate range of 130 km and which included a relay capability to either a ground station or another aircraft. The photograph of the aircraft taken in May 1989 depicts it fitted with an under-fuselage sensor/tv camera offset to the left side and various extra aerials. Details of operations in this role have, unfortunately, not been made public.

(https://i.postimg.cc/B6zF0WhR/vo146asd.jpg)
This photograph of No 6850, taken in May 1989, shows that the aircraft,
at that time, was fitted with an underfuselage sensor/camera and various aerials.

In 1990, after the introduction of Project Felstone, No 6850 was considered unsuitable for C-47 TP conversion, due to bad airframe conversion. This brought an end to the aircraft's operational service and it was grounded and placed in open storage at AFB Swartkop. In 1992, it was moved into position outside the SMF Museum hangars where it remained until June 2000, when it was transferred to Caesar's Palace, now known as Emperor's Palace (D Becker, 13 May 2009).

(https://i.ibb.co/BzzQPYJ/IMG-4133.jpg)

...and now time for some Spitfire porn again:

(https://i.ibb.co/nzdXxQw/IMG-4025.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 19, 2020, 02:50:28 AM
Here's a question for you experts.
Anyone know what this folded sheet attached to the wing's leading edge is good for?
It's there on both wings.

(https://i.ibb.co/FzzjTMY/IMG-4383.jpg)

The aircraft in question is an Atlas Impala Mk.II, S/N 1045:

(https://live.staticflickr.com/3950/15726051215_579b0a38f0_o.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 19, 2020, 06:50:39 AM
A de-icing boot?
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 19, 2020, 06:56:14 AM
You mean some kind of mounting for de-icing boots?
Highly unlikely me thinks.
What would such de-icing boots look like then?
Why is there no reference to such devices?
And after all: Mind you, this is a plane made in South Africa, for South Africa.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 19, 2020, 06:59:46 AM
De-icing boots tend to be a rubber thing on the leading edge of the wing some are heated and others inflate using bleed air from the engines, the fact that it’s in SA doesn’t matter as it’s still pretty cold at 30,000 feet
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 19, 2020, 07:01:16 AM
As I’m not there I cant say for sure it’s just a guess
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 19, 2020, 07:01:50 AM
Might be a vortex generator as well
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 19, 2020, 07:12:10 AM
No worries and thanks for the guess.
Now that there is no rubber thing on that plane and I couldn't find any trace of de-icing boots on any Impala or MB-326 for that matter, I'm afraid that I still don't believe it's related to de-icing.
Sure it's cold at 30k feet, but it's quite unlikely for an Impala to fly into thunderstorm clouds at FL 300 intentionally ;)
The only anti-icing thing that is known on the MB-326 is compressor bleed air for the windscreen.

The vortex generator might make sense, at least some aerodynamic device to a similar effect, as I don't really see how a folded sheet like this could create vortices...

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Mick on January 19, 2020, 07:56:33 AM
... here is the Aermacchi MB326 K (K stands for Kombat) cutaway, and this mysterious part is not even represented ... :-X

(https://i.postimg.cc/tTFxMD6q/MB-326.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ygYxJmnt)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Plowshare on January 19, 2020, 08:19:10 AM
From Wikipedia:
"It was also found that the Corsair's right wing could stall and drop rapidly and without warning during slow carrier landings. In addition, if the throttle were suddenly advanced (for example, during an aborted landing) the left wing could stall and drop so quickly that the fighter could flip over with the rapid increase in power. These potentially lethal characteristics were later solved through the addition of a small, 6 in (150 mm)-long stall strip to the leading edge of the outer right wing, just outboard of the gun ports. This allowed the right wing to stall at the same time as the left."

I wonder if these parts serve the same purpose? It sure looks the same as images I've seen of the Corsair. However, why on both wings? The jet engine doesn't develop the torque that a radial engine and prop would so perhaps the two strips just affect the stall speed?
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 19, 2020, 08:31:13 AM
I think Plowshare nailed it.
Probably it's related to what is being described here: http://fighterjet.com.au/2016/12/15/macchi-mb-326h/
Quote
Just over halfway through its service life it was decided to complete a ‘life of type extension’ by refurbishing the wing mounts and re-skinning the wings. This proved to be a disaster with one aircraft suffering a catastrophic failure of the wing attachment point in mid-air killing the pilot FLTLT Russ Page. It was subsequently found that the refurbishing of the wing mounting points was not conducted correctly. Additionally the wing re-skinning was also unsuccessful requiring small triangular pieces of metal, called sharks teeth, to be attached to the wing leading edge to ensure proper airflow over the wing surface.

Probably it's been used to induce kind of an "artificial stall" so that the wing would enter a controlled stall further inboard, far away from the ailerons, before the plane would actually enter an uncontrollable stall on the outboard wing section.
That at least would make sense.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Piotrek1 on January 20, 2020, 12:06:15 PM
Great topic, with a dose of humour and reliable information about aviation issues, and also a beautiful example of cooperation and yours friendship, I think you're guys on a good course, so keep it up! ]thumbsup[
It was nice to meet you "face to face" and learn how other users spend their free time and what their interests are, Thank you also for wanting to share your privacy with us 8).

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator

Best regards,
Piotrek
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 22, 2020, 09:06:25 AM
Thanks Piotrek.
It's been a really great time.
South Africa is an absolutely cool country, definitely worth visiting, and Piet+Marli took very good care of me 8)
We've done things that would be absolutely Verboten! anywhere in germany and probably across whole europe.
Cool stuff, all time.

Time for some engine porn again.
This was the first time for me to see a BMW 003 in real life.

(https://i.ibb.co/FK3ThN7/IMG-4488.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/9VZdQ9h/IMG-4491.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/khYQ7xB/IMG-4492.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/FDLk95k/IMG-4495.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 22, 2020, 09:09:14 AM
its really amazing how modern that engine looks, if i didnt know what it was i would say it was from a business jet or something
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 22, 2020, 09:20:40 AM
In fact the BMW 003 was technically ahead of the Jumo 004 in many ways, the only big issue was that the thrust of the initial series (A-2) was lower than the one of the Jumo, which is why the Jumo was the preferred fallback engine for the first german jets - apart from teething development problems, but the same applied to both engines, Jumo and BMW.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 22, 2020, 09:23:57 AM
Here's a question for you experts.
Anyone know what this folded sheet attached to the wing's leading edge is good for?
It's there on both wings.



]cheers[
Mike


Sorry to interject, but I asked around a bit, and found the explanation of these strips. I quote:

Quote
Harry Foulds: Stall strip.
Stall strips are used to initiate flow separation at chosen locations on the wing during high-angle of attack flight, so as to improve the controllability of the aircraft when it enters stall. They are typically employed in pairs, symmetrically on both wings.

Quote
Pieter Delen: It is a pre warning of an approaching stall. It causes earlier airflow separation over the inboard part of the wings at high AOA, so this turbulent air flows over the tail and the pilot feels this turbulence through the stick as buffeting, while the outboard part of the wings still have good airflow and yhe ailerons stil function to keep the wings level. If you just push forward on the stick - AOA decreases, normal airflow resumes and the impending stall is averted.

armed with "stall strips" to google, I found them on another aircraft,

https://www.flightlineweekly.com/single-post/2018/01/15/de-Havilland-Canada-DHC-1-Chipmunk

Quote
Strakes were fitted to deter spin conditions and stall breaker strips along the inboard leading edges of the wing ensured that a stall would originate in this position as opposed to the outboard section.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 22, 2020, 09:26:23 AM
Fine, perfect match for what Plowshare and /me came up with.

Probably it's been used to induce kind of an "artificial stall" so that the wing would enter a controlled stall further inboard, far away from the ailerons, before the plane would actually enter an uncontrollable stall on the outboard wing section.
That at least would make sense.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 22, 2020, 09:27:47 AM
Fine, perfect match for what Plowshare and /me came up with.

Probably it's been used to induce kind of an "artificial stall" so that the wing would enter a controlled stall further inboard, far away from the ailerons, before the plane would actually enter an uncontrollable stall on the outboard wing section.
That at least would make sense.

]cheers[
Mike

yup. you guys were right on the money!
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 22, 2020, 09:28:17 AM
As always - you just forgot to say :P
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on January 22, 2020, 09:28:44 AM
makes sense the mirages and  Saab Viggen have a set up called dog teeth
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 22, 2020, 09:29:37 AM
Saab Viggen is mean.
I hope they'll have one on the Danish Air Show this year.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 22, 2020, 01:20:30 PM
As always - you just forgot to say :P

Quote
Danie Pretorius : l did the final assembly of the odd number Mk2 Impalas at Atlas. For the very first testflight we fitted these stall angles at a zero incedence on both wings with aluminium tape, very much like duck tape. The pilot do a approach configuration stall at 25,000 feet. If one wing stall before the other wing then the aircraft roll over. We will then move the stall angle down by 1 or 2 mm on the dropping wing or upwards 1 or 2 mm on the flying wing. We will keep on adjusting these stall angles up or down until the aircraft's wings stall simintainiously to provide a 'safe' stall. Only then we finally poprivited these stall angles permanently to the wing.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Knochenlutscher on January 22, 2020, 01:36:33 PM
My Cousin is infected by South Africa and Australia, he does yearly Trips to both. Everytime he forgets the Biltong I wished to
taste, bringing me Newspapers instead.  :P Anyway, found a way to produce a cheap copycat made out of Eastern German Beef and
some Spices my aunt brought me from South Africa. Rouladen Biltong a la Knoch, absolute emergency style, but tasty, my Cats and Familly didn't like it,
so it must be tasty.
Keep an eye on each other and have nice days

Best wishes
Tobias
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 23, 2020, 11:35:34 PM
Say Piet, did you actually talk to Harry Foulds, Pieter Delen and Danie Pretorius or where did you get those quotes from (books, ...)?
I'm wondering about Danie's quote and the efforts to get the perfect balanced stall on both wings.
I think to remember from other source that in later years, due to deteriorating conditions of MB-326 airframes in latin american countries, they used to swap wings among planes until they got a couple of working ones together.
Must be horror if every time you have to redo a dozen flights after that, just to get back a plane that doesn't kill it's pilot in the first accellerated stall low level.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 24, 2020, 06:50:33 AM
I made contact with Danie. We established a little later that he was indeed the person who fitted these strips on this exact plane we saw, nr 1045 (an odd number, so one of his), in the late 70s.

As I understand, they only used tape until they got the position right, and then affixed them permanently. Or as permanently as they could (Danie remarked that he is glad to see 1045's strips had not fallen off yet, smiley face)

I was also informed that the new Hawk mk120s that the SAAF are flying also have stall strips.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 24, 2020, 06:56:38 AM
Quite interesting stuff, thanks for sharing that information with us Piet :)
Lots of interesting people with interesting vita, and it seems you know them all :D

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 24, 2020, 08:31:00 AM
Quite interesting stuff, thanks for sharing that information with us Piet :)
Lots of interesting people with interesting vita, and it seems you know them all :D

]cheers[
Mike

lol. Not true as you know, all I have is the one single superpower that apparently almost no other men have, and that seems to lead to all this . :D

But seriously though, all the ex employees, technicians, engineers, soldiers, pilots, etc off this entire world are mostly still here, and are very willing to answer (and more) if asked a question.

To illustrate: That disastrous french bvr missile you showed me. I found out after discussing our visit with someone else afterwards, that the lead engineer of the south african team who went to france for a few years to study the development of it and then initiate further development back here (and in partnership with israel I think?), the lady who was his personal assistant for the last 20 years of his career, now runs the ammunition register at the workshop I took you to, I even introduced her to you. She still makes me a cup of coffee every day at work. The reason she does not ever talk about anything of that is because she does not know which, if any of it, anyone might find interesting.

It is almost like realizing your neighbor is a mini version of Traudl Junge  ;D
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 24, 2020, 08:54:48 AM
all I have is the one single superpower
You work for BMW 8)
Does that make sense for anyone else? Ask me if I care lol :P

That disastrous french bvr missile you showed me
To get others to hook up on our chit-chat, it's the Matra R530. Supercrap.

(https://i.ibb.co/RHyzrYD/IMG-4421.jpg)

that the lead engineer of the south african team who went to france for a few years to study the development of it and then initiate further development back here
Is it the one we met in the backyard of the new shop?
The one you've tried to drag into a missile discussion with me?
Haha... futile attempt :P

the lady who was his personal assistant for the last 20 years of his career, now runs the ammunition register at the workshop I took you to, I even introduced her to you
I think I know who you are talking of.
The world's such a small space.
Guess there's lots of things to proceed further upon on my next visit 8)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 24, 2020, 09:52:14 AM


That disastrous french bvr missile you showed me
To get others to hook up on our chit-chat, it's the Matra R530. Supercrap.
Yup!
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 26, 2020, 01:49:38 AM
One of my favourite pictures of the whole trip:

(https://i.ibb.co/d0qK8LX/IMG-20200106-WA0004.jpg)

Falls into the "things you can't book in advance" category 8)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 31, 2020, 12:06:44 AM
/ me with "my" type of gun, the AR-15 rifle:
(https://i.ibb.co/rfN8KYF/Mike-AR15.jpg)

Piet and his IL-2 of revolvers, the Ruger GP100:
(https://i.ibb.co/M1DbCwB/Piet-Ruger-GP100.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Gaston on January 31, 2020, 05:26:14 AM
Maybe you would like to use my toys :


(https://i.postimg.cc/cJKZ3fQW/IMG-0551.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/FfQ25dWC)

-K31,
-SIG510 (FAss 57),
-SIG P210.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on January 31, 2020, 05:50:24 AM
The Sturmgewehr 57 indeed looks like it's something I could use.
But mind you, I'm a pacifist :D

Another pacifist can be seen on this image, together with his bodyguard.
That son of a gun has no idea how lucky he is - she really loves him!

(https://i.ibb.co/KLHDJcF/IMG-20200105-WA0003.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Gaston on January 31, 2020, 08:09:54 AM
Oh, I am a pacifist too... even if I like guns ! and shooting too !

But like ancient Romans said : "Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum !".
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on January 31, 2020, 08:36:56 AM

Another pacifist can be seen on this image, together with his bodyguard.
That son of a gun has no idea how lucky he is - she really loves him!


She better love me, I paid a lot of money for her!!  :D
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: <Gunny> on January 31, 2020, 08:59:20 AM
 I see you guys like to do some shooting.. That is GREAT...
Being a gun nut myself I have some thing for you to try ...
This is a little handgun drill I do so have some fun with it....
Shoot a playing card.....
Place the card on your target stand. like this .
(https://i.postimg.cc/hGD4tJ4C/IMG-0619.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/pmSM0LF8)
This is what it looks like... Now back away 4.5 M or 15 feet.
(https://i.postimg.cc/KY0GkZRm/Card-1.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Then shoot the card ---No time limit - use all the ammo you want.
This is what it should look like......
(https://i.postimg.cc/DwjfmvWn/IMG-0621.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/ts6GMHtM)

My gun is a 1911 45 ACP good luck and have fun...... ;)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 01, 2020, 11:00:36 AM
She better love me, I paid a lot of money for her!!  :D
I'll better ask for her version of that story :P

I see you guys like to do some shooting.. That is GREAT...
Nothing against shooting, that's been a hell lot of fun - I got to shoot stuff I never dreamt of and even made peace with handguns again.
However what's been at least as fascinating as the shooting itself to me was the making of ammunition ourselves, plus dismantling and maintenance of the weapons after shooting and last but not least the historic collection of shooting stuff.
Unfortunately I didn't take pictures of our dismantling / maintenance session, it's been late in the day and I've apparently been too fascinated of the action itself than to think of taking pictures.
But here's some pics of the ammunition making and one of a pretty historic gun:

(https://i.ibb.co/TgZNtvq/IMG-4562.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/Kw1xSRT/IMG-4556.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/Pm9y5kh/IMG-4558.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/v4QxqVx/20200109-110513.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: <Gunny> on February 01, 2020, 11:09:39 AM
I have the same press and that is the best around.
I have been reloading my ammo for ever..... ;)
Rifle- Shotgun - and hand guns...
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: LuseKofte on February 01, 2020, 11:47:50 AM
Nice read this topic.
Been in SA several times in the 80’s
Seafood and such I know. But your tour seems funnier
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 01, 2020, 11:48:18 AM
Since in my former life I've been shooting guns in military service only, ammo to me was something that comes ready out of the box and gets depleted as it goes.
That reloading stuff was quite new to me and it's amazing, both for economic efficiency and even more because of the technical things involved, really interesting to see how it works and get things explained in detail by an expert like Piet.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Sillius_Sodus on February 01, 2020, 12:12:56 PM
Noice!  8)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: LuseKofte on February 02, 2020, 05:10:50 AM
Since in my former life I've been shooting guns in military service only, ammo to me was something that comes ready out of the box and gets depleted as it goes.
That reloading stuff was quite new to me and it's amazing, both for economic efficiency and even more because of the technical things involved, really interesting to see how it works and get things explained in detail by an expert like Piet.

]cheers[
Mike
Quite normal to reuse cartridges in Norway. Most people here do it for presission and consisted power on their bullets. Did this while I hunted. But when moving to a penthouse I have no room for that activity. I gave my stash to a friend. I stopped hunting sold my guns
When my arthritis affected my feet and a falling accident proved to ruin my ankles.
I can walk long way, just do not trust safe return from mountain anymore. Up here that is lethal.
Extraordinary story this topic. I know you both to be the most cool prople I ever known
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 03, 2020, 09:05:57 AM
Thanks for the flowers Otto 8)
The coolest guy however is this one, he lets hang loose like no one else does:

(https://i.ibb.co/xqPdX1R/IMG-3641.jpg)

These two come f*ckin' close though :D

(https://i.ibb.co/dgmkDgM/IMG-3802.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on February 03, 2020, 10:38:28 AM
Thanks for the flowers Otto 8)

These two come f*ckin' close though :D
]cheers[
Mike

 :D :D :D

I really am loving this revisit of our visit! Brightens up my day every time I visit the thread.

 ]thumleft[ ]cheers[
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Moggy Cattermole on February 06, 2020, 01:58:50 PM
That's really awesome, gents!
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 06, 2020, 10:50:23 PM
Piet with the real MOAB here, I'm sure our experts will figure out which type it is in no time.

(https://i.ibb.co/r5qSNLb/IMG-4445.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: LuseKofte on February 08, 2020, 05:04:20 AM
MOAB = Massive Ordnance Air Blast = USA in my belief and got nothing to do with WW 2, at least that was my understanding
 SC 1000 =Sprengbombe Cylindrisch 1000 = was a large air-dropped general-purpose thin cased high explosive demolition bomb utilized by Germany and in our sim was flown by JU 87 D5 (  question that) JU 88/188 DO 217K HE 111
Or SC 1800 or SC 2000, but it do not look that big
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Mick on February 08, 2020, 07:30:06 AM
... yep, the MOAB is much larger and powerful ...  ;)

https://www.yakimaherald.com/news/u-s-drops-mother-of-all-bombs-in-afghanistan/article_0134d00a-20cd-11e7-8349-73671da77811.html

(https://i.postimg.cc/v8hNDZQd/moab-daisy-cutter-tallboy-grand-slam-size-comparison-of-the-1886.png) (https://postimages.org/)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 08, 2020, 08:47:49 AM
MOAB is also "mother of all bombs", just saying.
Of course it's not a GBU-43/B. If you'd go that way, MOAB could mean a whole lot more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moab_(disambiguation)

Otto is absolutely right, it's an SC-1000 "Hermann", which in WW2 terms is the "mother of all bombs" as it was produced and much larger numbers than the few bigger ones available (SC-1200/1800/2000/2500) and was much more versatile.
In that sense, it was about the biggest Kraut Bomb you could expect to get dropped on your head at that time.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 08, 2020, 04:21:23 PM
I think if either one is dropped on your head it’s not really going to matter how much bigger one or the other is
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 09, 2020, 01:00:00 AM
Here's one for our experts again.
You don't need to guess the guy on that image, he's not relevant ]clown[
You can probably guess the aircraft behind him in no time.
But now comes the challenge: What type of torpedo do we see here?

(https://i.ibb.co/ryXXj5b/IMG-4463.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 09, 2020, 06:09:33 AM
Looks like a G7 u-boat torpedo  it’s way too small to be a long lance
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Stainless on February 09, 2020, 08:20:58 AM
To me it looks like a Mk VIII aerial torpedo with a missing propellor guard

Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: LuseKofte on February 09, 2020, 12:18:38 PM
That cute little torpedo need to be airborn
Guess it is same type swordfish used to attack Bismark.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Bwf. on February 09, 2020, 12:57:50 PM
It looks like a USN Mk13:
(http://www.mediafire.com/file/7gy4cl79wkimfg0/Mk13_airial_torpedo.jpg/file)
If it is, it would be interesting to find out how it ended up in SA.
 ]cheers[
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 09, 2020, 11:07:33 PM
Looks like a G7 u-boat torpedo  it’s way too small to be a long lance
Nope.

To me it looks like a Mk VIII aerial torpedo with a missing propellor guard
Nope.

It looks like a USN Mk13
Nope.

That cute little torpedo need to be airborn
Guess it is same type swordfish used to attack Bismark.
Spot on, it's the Mk. XII Torpedo, the same type used by the Swordfish to sink the Bismarck.

(https://i.ibb.co/ScTr1bG/IMG-4467.jpg)

Now... I thought it would be too easy, but no one guessed the aircraft type yet.
Probably childs play nevertheless, just saying.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: BalDaddy on February 10, 2020, 02:40:35 AM
Hawker Hart or Hind....difficult to discern as it's camouflaged!
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 03:18:35 AM
Nope and nope :P
See, it's not as easy as it seems.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: sniperton on February 10, 2020, 03:40:51 AM
Honestly, based on a photo it's really not that easy to differentiate between a Hart, Hind, or Hartebeest.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 03:42:38 AM
But since we are in South Africa...
You got it sniperton 8)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: sniperton on February 10, 2020, 05:26:06 AM
But since we are in South Africa...

Sill a bit odd that all members of the Hart family had distinct type names.
Imagine this for the 109, "ME Gustav-Friedrich" for G6, "ME Gustav-Heinrich" for G8, etc, etc.  ;D
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 05:39:16 AM
This one would be called "ME Frustav Frankenstein" then.
Two pictures of the same aircraft.
Spot the "issues":

(https://i.ibb.co/89c9M19/IMG-4436.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/DWDmkkP/IMG-4434.jpg)

Hint: There are at least two "issues" shown here. One is obvious, the other not that much.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 10, 2020, 05:50:43 AM
Well the tire is shot and its missing the rest of the wheel cover, the struts look pretty short like they are compressed fully too
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 05:52:45 AM
That's even two more.
The tires aren't really shot, but let's agree they're not fully inflated.
Wheel covers might have been removed intentionally, that's been a quite common field mod to counter mud/dust/sand issues.

Still two things to go at least.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 10, 2020, 05:55:39 AM
hmm its an old benz motor thats not leaking oil
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 05:58:03 AM
Hahaha... yes that's been about what I commented.
But that's not the thing I'm referring to either.
Still two to go at least :D

Hint: One thing is so f**king obvious that you can easily overlook it.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 10, 2020, 05:58:08 AM
looks like the brake line is gone too
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 06:00:00 AM
Hm... maybe we're talking about the same thing already.

Please specify this a tad more closely:
its missing the rest of the wheel cover
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 10, 2020, 06:11:13 AM
the metal plate on the inner side that looks like half a wheel spat so its flush with the wing when the gear is closed, the hole also looks much bigger then the wheel so im guessing something else is missing, if its an E model its also missing the MG FF ammo drum bulge
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 06:25:28 AM
Talking about this one?

(https://i.postimg.cc/N0dMrqQR/440px-Bf109-G2-jpg-440-330.png)

As I said, sometimes they just removed it so the gear won't get blocked:
(https://i.postimg.cc/TPsLhLjr/35b491303819ebaee6a09b436c4cb501.jpg)

But that's not what I was talking about. And no, it's not an Emil (the spinner gives that away).
Still two to go at least.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 10, 2020, 06:37:41 AM
ill let someone else have a go the only undercarriage im intimately familiar  with is for a king air and the one on a 727   
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: sniperton on February 10, 2020, 07:49:13 AM
I have the feeling that the undercarriage is simply too short and the wheels are way too small for a 109.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 07:51:29 AM
Eh... what?
sniperton got the plane type already, it's a Hawker Hartebeest (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawker_Hart#Hawker_Hartebeest) ;)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Bigmug on February 10, 2020, 09:20:36 AM
Hi!
Guess I found the obvious one: The undercarriage bay of the left wing is of the wrong shape. Shoukd be horseshoe-shaped instead of round. No idea what the other issue might be.
Have a nice day,
Bigmug.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: [FAC]Ghost129er on February 10, 2020, 09:27:04 AM
Wow, I really am blind.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 10:00:32 AM
Well done Bigmug, that's indeed the obvious part.

So there's just the hidden part left.
Hint: You have to look at self-shadowing plane parts, and you have to look real close and carefully.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Mick on February 10, 2020, 10:05:08 AM
... missing hydraulic brake tubes ...?  :-X

(https://i.postimg.cc/vBmmJMrs/109.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/zL95hs2t)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 10, 2020, 10:20:53 AM
sniperton mentioned this before, but that's not what I'm talking about.
The hydraulic tubes have been removed to counter the inevitable leaks which would occur over the years otherwise.

What I'm talking about is a similar left/right mismatch like the one Bigmug spotted.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: [FAC]Ghost129er on February 10, 2020, 10:58:58 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/fRiS1at.png)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 11, 2020, 02:10:32 AM
Close but no cigar.
The right picture actually illustrates how some of the inspection plates have been removed to get access to the inner wing structure, probably to counter corrosion. Most likely this has been done by the museum staff themselves.
But that's still not what I was referring to 8)
I know I'm a nasty bugger, and honestly I might not have seen it myself if Piet won't have alerted me of the issue I'm referring to here.
Try again :D

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: BalDaddy on February 11, 2020, 02:50:18 AM
You're such a tease Mike.....
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 11, 2020, 03:39:46 AM
I love being that :D
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: sniperton on February 11, 2020, 04:08:58 AM
The outer panel on the right wing is fastened with countersunk slot drive screws, that's clearly visible on the 2nd photo.
On the left side the fasteners seem to be different, but the picture lacks detail to be sure about it.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 11, 2020, 04:44:45 AM
The picture of the left wing is a bit blurred in the regarding area, but the screws are of the same countersunk slot drive type like on the right wing, rest assured.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 11, 2020, 05:48:26 AM
This is a bit OT but how do the brakes on a 109 work? are they in the hub? because i dont see any sign of a brake rotor on the wheel
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 11, 2020, 07:12:30 AM
The 109 has rather small drum brakes on the inside of the wheels (not visible on these pictures).
They've been a big issue in real life as they were rather weak for the 109s mass and had a habit of locking up when pushing the brake pedals too hard.
That's why for instance Meier Motors (Fighter Factory in Usedom/Germany) uses to replace these brakes with disc brakes.

So... that's not the issue, but the wheels are worth a closer look *hint* *hint*

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Mick on February 11, 2020, 07:14:41 AM
... no rotor and disk pads, good ole brake shoes inside the wheel hub ...  ;)

(https://i.postimg.cc/G2BnRrjw/post-868-0-07646300-1385154679.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/k6dpN0Zf)

Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: sniperton on February 11, 2020, 07:32:07 AM
the wheels are worth a closer look *hint* *hint*

The wheel hubs are different, is it what you mean?
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Mick on February 11, 2020, 07:37:56 AM
... yep, I think you are right, sniperton ...!  ;)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 11, 2020, 07:51:29 AM
Exactly.
Left hand side has open spokes, right hand side closed ones.
You got it, finally 8)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 11, 2020, 09:47:35 AM
By the way... if you should ever come to this place:
(https://i.ibb.co/0Gbbrz2/20200106-125651.jpg)

Don't miss visiting No. 35 (square B1):
(https://i.ibb.co/BLSGwwC/heksieshideaway.jpg)
https://heksieshideaway.co.za/hideaway/

Because that's where you get to see things like this:
(https://i.ibb.co/d0qK8LX/IMG-20200106-WA0004.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on February 11, 2020, 10:04:37 AM
Hi!
Guess I found the obvious one: The undercarriage bay of the left wing is of the wrong shape. Shoukd be horseshoe-shaped instead of round. No idea what the other issue might be.
Have a nice day,
Bigmug.

Just to elaborate on this. The port wing is from an F, the starboard wing is from a G.  I was the first to discover this and the wheel issue of course, many years ago.

The plane was assembled from abandoned pieces from captures airbases, by SAAF mechanics.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 11, 2020, 10:33:35 AM
hmm reminds me of a cessna i worked on in aviation repair school, we did an annual inspection as it was an airplane the school had just bought(and flown!) the inspection came about as my instructor and I had pushed the airplane under the wing of our 727, well we ran the wing into the bottom of it when we parked it(whoops). they took the wing panel off the plane and found that the wing was held together with corrosion and they previous owners had just slapped a shiny coat of paint on it. we also discovered in researching the plane some more that it had been wrecked twice and flipped over on the ground, the left wing was 3 inches shorter then the right so we figured that it most likely had been "repaired" by simply fitting another wing from another aircraft. that was far from the only issues we found with it but thats another story   
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 11, 2020, 10:33:47 AM
I was the first to discover this and the wheel issue of course, many years ago.

^^See guys, that's da man ]thumbsup[

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: sniperton on February 11, 2020, 06:24:31 PM
(https://i.ibb.co/d0qK8LX/IMG-20200106-WA0004.jpg)

Piet looks fine and dandy, but the cattle appear to be stuffed and like in a showcase diorama. No question chilli is needed in quantity to bring life into this.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 11, 2020, 10:34:59 PM
the cattle appear to be stuffed and like in a showcase diorama. No question chilli is needed in quantity to bring life into this

That picture was just a selfie with Piet's Smartphone.
(https://i.ibb.co/d0qK8LX/IMG-20200106-WA0004.jpg)

Here are two pictures I took with mine.
If you compare the three pictures to each other, you will notice that all creatures depicted are alive and really moving there.

(https://i.ibb.co/svwdFr4/20200106-161644.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/0f52XVB/20200106-161646.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on February 11, 2020, 11:14:36 PM
That is such a cool place. We are going to go find it again soon (also to restock the chilli sauces :D )
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: sniperton on February 12, 2020, 02:37:48 AM
Is it a place where you can point out which one you want to eat?  :D

(Still it's hard to believe they are not just animated figures until I can smell their urine  8) )
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 12, 2020, 02:42:05 AM
Almost.
They're all real - for real.
When we arrived, there was only the cock occupying his (at least so he thought) trough.
Then he went away and the horses came to have some water.
The cock wasn't amused about the horses standing at his trough and there was a lot of cock-a-doodle-doo.
That in turn attracted the cows, and the result was what you see on the pictures.

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: BalDaddy on February 12, 2020, 04:14:10 AM
Is it a place where you can point out which one you want to eat?  :D

Anybody else think of this when reading this post?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAF35dekiAY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAF35dekiAY)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on February 12, 2020, 06:53:54 AM
Is it a place where you can point out which one you want to eat?  :D

Anybody else think of this when reading this post?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAF35dekiAY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAF35dekiAY)

Exactly what I thought about! :D ]cheers[
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 12, 2020, 08:52:13 AM
Time for something completely different 8)

Anyone with japanese language skills here?
Sorry for the blurred image, this was behind glass:
(https://i.ibb.co/p3G9kB0/IMG-4167.jpg)

And for those not into swords as much, here's some mean guns.
See the lower Anti-Tank gun and imagine the recoil when you shoot that thing:
(https://i.ibb.co/xMg4yYk/IMG-4519.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: [FAC]Ghost129er on February 12, 2020, 09:01:44 AM
I'm sure that last Anti Tank rifle makes people go.


BOIIIIIIIIIIIIII
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 12, 2020, 09:21:24 AM
looks like a Boys anti tank rifle they were infamous for their vicious kick, its like 14mm caliber but the casing for the round is giant, it couldnt do much damage against a panzer so they were aimed at the visors, gunsights and track links 
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 12, 2020, 09:23:14 AM
the finns made one called a Lhati that fired 20mm rounds but it had to be carried by two men and had its own built in sled
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 12, 2020, 10:05:30 AM
looks like a Boys anti tank rifle
Top to bottom it's:

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: [FAC]Ghost129er on February 12, 2020, 10:33:07 AM
Top to bottom it's:
  • Boys Mk.I (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boys_anti-tank_rifle) calibre .5507'' (13.99mm)

YE BOIIIIIIII! Know me a Boys ATR when I see one 8)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: BalDaddy on February 12, 2020, 12:36:31 PM
Difficult to decipher the form Kanji takes on a tang.
Often it is the province, period, date, other side master's name.
Sometimes it is a legend expressing loyalty or sacrifice.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 19, 2020, 09:26:28 AM
No one else having a clue of that japanese text on the sword?

Well then... for the time being, you can guess what this pinnacle of british engineering wants to be:
(https://i.ibb.co/zSHLsw2/IMG-4297.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Gubi on February 19, 2020, 10:02:58 AM
One of the close assault versions of the Churchill...Mk VIII maybe...
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 19, 2020, 10:16:04 AM
Churchill AVRE 94mm petard demolition mortar
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 20, 2020, 12:32:29 AM
Flanker nailed it.
Actually this Churchill was born as a Mk. IV with completely different shape and weapons, but it got converted further and further until it finally received that freaking mortar in late '44.

See more details of this tank's history here (click to open larger image and zoom/pan around as you like):

(https://i.ibb.co/LYZsM6D/IMG-4295.jpg)

And two more detail shots of the amazingly complex construction here:

(https://i.ibb.co/mTTnvm1/IMG-4298.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/sWg5yn9/IMG-4299.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: BalDaddy on February 20, 2020, 04:12:38 AM
Used as a 'Devilish Duo' the other part of the combination being the Churchill 'Crocodile' flame thrower.
the petard would hurl a shell to crack a bunker or reinforced strongpoint. The stunned unfortunates inside would be then immolated by a deluge of flame from the Croc; the flaming liquid seeping through the cracks or depriving those inside of oxygen.
My late father-in-law commanded a Croc in early 1945. He maintained that the knowledge of the mere presence of this inhumane weapon caused the demoralised German troops, at that late stage in the conflict poorly trained, sub-standard and often very young, to surrender or run.

A fellow commander was berated by an outraged Heer officer that the usage of the Croc was "unfair and un-British!"

I found it hard to associate this kind and gentle man I knew as a lovely caring Granddad to my 4 children with using such an awful weapon, though he claimed he never had to use it in anger. "I only burnt some old huts!" at Belsen Bergen perhaps? 7th Armoured were nearby, but grim faced he wouldn't expand further.
Postwar he went onto Comets, and armoured cars during the partition of India. When 7th Armoured was disbanded in 1957, he went into Air Despatch, retiring in 1972.
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 20, 2020, 05:48:51 AM
notice how thick the armor on the Churchill is, its 152mm in some places so thicker then a tigers armor! it was handicapped by poor engines so was ponderously slow and wasnt equipped with a decent gun until later in the war 
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: BalDaddy on February 20, 2020, 12:07:48 PM
Surprised the Germans in Italy with it's climbing ability though Flanker.
Slow, as it was designed as an infantry tank. could withstand a hit from an 88
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Flanker27 on February 20, 2020, 12:24:48 PM
if i recall it was the only allied tank that could withstand a direct hit from an 88
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on February 23, 2020, 02:19:36 AM
Here is one that fell through the cracks

(https://i.postimg.cc/bJbT1W3V/2018-01-01-030.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/dksrYHMG)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on February 23, 2020, 03:06:42 AM
Cool desktop wallpaper 8)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on March 30, 2020, 02:06:52 AM
Guys whenever that lockdown in SA is over, drop me a note.
I wanna emigrate.
This is not funny anymore... 7 AM in Germany:

(https://i.ibb.co/NFFqV1P/20200330-063743.jpg)

(https://i.ibb.co/0K3Wkg8/20200330-063818-2.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: Otsu on April 13, 2020, 03:28:46 AM
Time for something completely different 8)

Anyone with japanese language skills here?
Sorry for the blurred image, this was behind glass:
(https://i.ibb.co/p3G9kB0/IMG-4167.jpg)

]cheers[
Mike
I asked a friend and here's what he said
"Pour ton sabre, c'est le nom de l'artisan Fujiwara Kiyomitu à Harima (c'est à côté de Kobe) c'est à peu près 13 et 14ème siècle. On voit bien qu'il a été "utilisé" car on voit plusieurs trous dû aux nombreux affûtages qui raccourcissent la lame."
"For your sword, it's the name of the craftsman Fujiwara Kiyomitu in Harima (it's next to Kobe) it's about 13 and 14th century. It is clear that it has been "used" because we see several holes due to the numerous sharpenings that shorten the blade."
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on April 13, 2020, 05:38:16 AM

I asked a friend and here's what he said
"Pour ton sabre, c'est le nom de l'artisan Fujiwara Kiyomitu à Harima (c'est à côté de Kobe) c'est à peu près 13 et 14ème siècle. On voit bien qu'il a été "utilisé" car on voit plusieurs trous dû aux nombreux affûtages qui raccourcissent la lame."
"For your sword, it's the name of the craftsman Fujiwara Kiyomitu in Harima (it's next to Kobe) it's about 13 and 14th century. It is clear that it has been "used" because we see several holes due to the numerous sharpenings that shorten the blade."


wow :) Thank you!!!
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on April 13, 2020, 05:42:45 AM
Guys whenever that lockdown in SA is over, drop me a note.
I wanna emigrate.
This is not funny anymore... 7 AM in Germany:


]cheers[
Mike

Are you sure lol? If you posted a disloyal comment about the weather, which was generously provided for you by the benevolent state, like the one you just did, here in SA, police and army will come to your house and beat you to death from natural causes.  ;) Doubly so if you are some kind of degenerate, like for example, a cigarette smoker.

 ]cheers[
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on April 13, 2020, 06:29:18 AM
Yeah, thanks a lot Otsu and regards to your friend 8)

Guys whenever that lockdown in SA is over, drop me a note.
I wanna emigrate.
This is not funny anymore... 7 AM in Germany:
Are you sure lol? If you posted a disloyal comment about the weather, which was generously provided for you by the benevolent state, like the one you just did, here in SA, police and army will come to your house and beat you to death from natural causes.

If that's the price to pay for not having to stay in a fascistoid-hysterical hygienic state: Deal!

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on April 13, 2020, 06:54:57 AM
Yeah, thanks a lot Otsu and regards to your friend 8)

Guys whenever that lockdown in SA is over, drop me a note.
I wanna emigrate.
This is not funny anymore... 7 AM in Germany:
Are you sure lol? If you posted a disloyal comment about the weather, which was generously provided for you by the benevolent state, like the one you just did, here in SA, police and army will come to your house and beat you to death from natural causes.

If that's the price to pay for not having to stay in a fascistoid-hysterical hygienic state: Deal!

]cheers[
Mike

Indeed! I admit I still prefer it here

 :D :P ]cheers[
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: LuseKofte on April 13, 2020, 06:59:54 AM
Please Mike, take me with you. I am fed up wading in the snow
(https://i.postimg.cc/YqZj9Wvd/055-B6-DA7-F6-E3-4-C6-E-B139-1506-BB929-BD9.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~Storebror on April 13, 2020, 07:49:57 AM
I admit I still prefer it here
Only thing I need (for the time being at least) is a bodyguard. But I already have an idea 8)

Please Mike, take me with you.
If you paint that in the sand, make it larger.
You'll be in Africa after all :middle_finger_dancing_banana:

]cheers[
Mike
Title: Re: SAS~Storebror and SAS~Cirx in the same place
Post by: SAS~CirX on April 13, 2020, 12:10:26 PM
Please Mike, take me with you. I am fed up wading in the snow


 :D :D :D