Special Aircraft Service
The SAS Factory - Tech Help, Ancient Mods etc. => Dark Blue World Discussion & Support => The Keepsake: Old Mod Packs, Game Versions and Guest Mods => DBW Campaigns & Missions => Topic started by: Hamm66 on February 21, 2014, 11:57:08 PM
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The Classic Dogfight of the ETO 1945 - the P-51 Mustang vs the Fw 190. Date: 14 January 1945.
Here is the link for download:
http://www.mission4today.com/index.php?name=Downloads3&file=details&id=1925
And here is the link for the original thread with screen shots:
http://www.mission4today.com/index.php?name=ForumsPro&file=viewtopic&t=18347
Please note: 'Lean' versions of this mission pack are included in this download for players who experience FPS issues. This mission was built in DBW 1.71 and tested in HSFX (the AI in HSFX behaves somewhat differently but I found it to work). At the moment I have not been able to get even the Lean versions to work in UP3 or the SAS modact and when I loaded the Missions (Lean or otherwise) into The Full Monty I had serious FPS issues.
The Situation:
The Classic Dogfight of the ETO 1945 - the P-51 Mustang vs the Fw 190. Date: 14 January 1945. You will find yourself either escorting B-17s on a daylight bomber mission (Allies) or on a mission to disrupt fighter-bombers attacking the German retreating forces near St Vith (Axis).
The Battle of the Bulge is nearly over and the Germans are in retreat. To stop them bringing up reinforcements the USAAF has sent a bomber mission, with escort, to knock out the bridges in Cologne. USAAF Pilots are under standing orders to attack enemy fighters whenever and wherever they find them, 'Bring no bullets home!' is the order of the day for Allied pilots.
Operation North Wind will sweep the Allies from the field if the Luftwaffe fighters can take control of the air. You will find yourself leading four Staffeln of Fw 190D-9 'Long-noses' from Nordhorn on a mission to stop fighter-bombers attacking German troops if you fly for the Axis.
The weather is good and it is 10:30 am as you approach the front line.
The Missions:
All of the missions start at the same time and on the same day - three in the Mustang and three in the Fw 190. The missions are numbered Version 1, 2 and 3 but this is not a measure of difficulty. Nor is the title an indication of what may happen in the mission. In an effort to reflect the fog of war each mission is laid out slightly differently with different advantages to either side.
Success should be possible if you aim to meet your mission objectives but not easy.
Mission Complete for all missions require you shoot down one opposing fighter and reach the designated recon point. There are Secondary and Hidden targets.
This is the fourth of a series of five mission packs based on the book 'Dogfight - The Greatest Air Duels of World War II' edited by Tony Holmes. Each 'chapter' features a pair of fighters; Spitfire IIA vs Bf 109E, P-47 Thunderbolt vs Bf 109G/K, P-40 Warhawk vs Ki-43 "Oscar", P-51 Mustang vs Fw 190 (this mission pack) and Seafire vs A6M Zero. The book discusses the advantages and disadvantages of each aircraft, the strategic situation in which they fought and the tactics used by the pilots on each side in an effort to succeed.
I have tried to reflect this in the missions so if the player uses the best tactics for the fighter he is in he should be able to complete the missions successfully.
(I will admit that at this stage I cannot complete the P-51 mission although the AI can. My flying skills are clearly not up to the task. In testing I allow the AI from either side to fight the battle, when I get the balance I want I fly the mission myself. Up until this mission I have always been able to get to Mission Complete and with the Fw 190 I have achieved this but with the P-51 I have failed constantly and consistently. I have still very much enjoyed the attempts and I hope that P-51 pilots out there can succeed where I have failed!)
To install:
Unpack the Mission folder to your DBW 1.71 folder and everything should go where it should.
There are no extra mods or skins needed.
Credits:
The maker of the Western Front-Winter 1944 map and everyone who contributed to DBW.
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I have a question concerning these missions. I just can't fly them. They load, make noise, and then the aircraft move very very slowly through the air. And that is even with the lean versions. I think that over the years I have never really understood the "memory" business and what is required to play this game. Sometime (most) missions and campaigns have worked well, sometime (this) not so well. Far as my PC I now have a AMD FX 6300 cpu, a MSI R7850 gpu, 8gb of ram, 240gb Samsung SSD but I play the game off of a 1tb WD hard drive, 630w Corsair psu. What am I lacking that would preclude me playing this mission? I am just curious more than anything else. It's just kinda puzzling to my 71 yr old mind (as are quite a few other things). Thanks for any info.
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I haven't run the above missions, but I have created missions with a lot of aircraft (50 to 100) and they have worked fine. I have found that any significant ground activity (moving, not stationary stuff) really slows down the action. I'm using an i7 processor running at almost 4GHz and this ground activity noticeably slows the frame rate. A slide show frame rate really kills the fun factor!
A couple of questions/suggestions might help understanding/solving your problem. If you using Direct X you would notice a big increase in frame rate with Open GL. Also what settings are you using ... If you are using perfect try a lower setting and even reducing the screen resolution a little could help a lot. There are a lot of settings in the conf.ini that will help with frame rate as well.
PS I'm 70 years old and understand some of your confusion ...
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With that computer you should rock!
You have way more than I have (unless I am misreading you).
Are you running any mods?
My DBW is clean but when I tried these missions on my Full Monty install they were very slow.
There may be one or more mods that do not like what I am building ( I am thinking the number of objects which runs close to the thousands in some of these missions).
Anyone else having the problem Mr Holmes is experiencing?
Hamm, thank you very much for responding. And thank you for the complement about my PC. I am afraid I can't take all of the credit for hardware. I ask for it on birthdays and at Christmas and my kids and grandkids will usually get me "parts". And I am kind of a guinea pig. They will buy parts so they can try them in my PC to see how they work. I do end up with some pretty good stuff, although usually not real current. And, even with my eyes being 71 like the rest of me, and kinda shaky nerves I still like to dig around the insides of a PC. But back to my question - I have installed most all of the "new" TFM mods (up to like 36 maybe). Do you reckon that is what is messing me up and keeping me from using your missions? I sometime wonder if it might be the graphics settings, through the Catalyst Control Center that I use, but I think I have them set at the least demanding although I can't be sure of that. I just don't understand what all that stuff is. Thank you again.
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I've had fps issues with other mods before.
My solution is to have clean versions of each 'type' of Il2 in separate places in my PC.
In the C drive I have a folder called 'Il2 All Versions' and in there I have the basic 1946 un modded and unpatched.
I then make a copy of this and rename it whatever modded version I want and update it. In this case DBW.
I then use the unmodded DBW to build the missions.
I also test the missions in unmodded versions of HSFX, TFM, 4.12.1 etc (depending on maps etc)
If you have added mods and its running slow I expect one of them is causing the drag but without testing each individual mod one at a time I couldn't guess which is causing the problem.
As I said in the earlier post, this mission does not work well in TFM which has 'all' the mods.
I know it sounds like a lot of work to run multiple versions of the game but I found it to be worth it and as you have a 1Tb drive you have loads of space (I am guessing) for messing around.
So, bottom line, Yes I think it likely that one of you modds is causing the issue. You say the lean versions also do not work? They have very little ground objects. I am surprised they are running slow. I would recommend a clean version of DBW for testing before messing with your video card settings as this game is not that demanding on the video card.
Thanks for that, Hamm, I may have to give it a try.
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... well I am not sure the diaporama problem has to do with another mod ...
I just gave that mission a try and the least I can say is that it is very hardware demanding ...
That many planes in the sky (and B17 bombers with 11 crew members each with a parachute ...!!) + that many convoys and troops + that many houses and static cameras ... no wonder I couldn't fly it and got the same diaporama ...
I had to considerably modify it in order to be able to fly it ...
I deleted all chiefs (convoys and troops), all US static vehicles, all added houses and static cameras, chopped down the P51s down to 2 per flight, B17Gs down to 3 per flight (WITHOUT parachute), FW190 D9s down to 3 per flight, and totally deleted the Typhoon flights ...
Yes, 13 years old IL2 can still put a "middle of the road PC" down to its knees ...!
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Hi Hamm66,
Well in fact my rig has got a weak element, and that's my GC which only sports 892 Mb of RAM (GTX260)
I didn't use the "lean" version because I wanted to test your mission "as is" to check if I had the same diaporama as Bob ...
Generally I make my own missions that I then assemble to make a campaign, and of course, mainly due to my "weak" GC, I pay great attention to "useless" details that can turn a mission into a diaporama ...
For ex, in your mission, if I fly a FW190 D9 on the blue side, my main target will be the bombers and fighters protecting them, so the Typhoons will be redundant and useless (I'll never see them, then never attack them), same with their targets ...
Also I never grant each bomber crew parachutes, simply because each time a B17 (for ex) is downed, you then have 11 crew members floating in the sky, if you and your colleagues down, say, 10 B17s, then that's 110 guys in the sky and for a looong time ...
Also realism wise you should replace the Japanese 75mm AA guns you used by the appropriate German 88mm Flak guns, and also delete the 2 Italian static Cant 1007 ... ;)
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... don't get me wrong Hamm, I was just trying to be positive in my criticism regarding "historical realism" ... ;)
Since we've got 88mm German Flak why not use them instead of JA (stands for Japan) guns, and let's use static He177s for ex instead of Italian Cants that never saw Germany ...
Here is the Cant for you ... :P
https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php?topic=24416.0
Please, don't you think, even for a second, that I never make mistakes myself ... :D
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... my mistake (I told you I regularly made some ... ;)) the "faulty" Italian planes are SM79s not Cants as I wrote ...(I was using a different PC than the one I use for my game when I posted... :()
Regarding German AA Artillery you can chose between:
_Static vehicles.artillery.Artillery$Flak18_88mm 2
_Static vehicles.artillery.Artillery$Flak18_37mm 2
_Static vehicles.artillery.Artillery$Flak38_20mm 2
vehicle mounted AA:
_Static vehicles.artillery.Artillery$DemagFlak 2 for your info: 20mm single barrel
_Static vehicles.artillery.Artillery$Wirbelwind 2 for your info: 20mm 4 barrels
_Static vehicles.artillery.Artillery$SdKfz6Flak37 2 for your info: 37mm single barrel
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I still have a less capable PC compared to the latest, will try it when in the mood tomorrow.
Often setting
Effects=1
In the config.ini Open GL section
helps reducing FPS hits.
:)
Wow, if you guys get FPS hits I should get a complete slideshow.
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I've had fps issues with other mods before.
My solution is to have clean versions of each 'type' of Il2 in separate places in my PC.
In the C drive I have a folder called 'Il2 All Versions' and in there I have the basic 1946 un modded and unpatched.
I then make a copy of this and rename it whatever modded version I want and update it. In this case DBW.
I then use the unmodded DBW to build the missions.
I also test the missions in unmodded versions of HSFX, TFM, 4.12.1 etc (depending on maps etc)
If you have added mods and its running slow I expect one of them is causing the drag but without testing each individual mod one at a time I couldn't guess which is causing the problem.
As I said in the earlier post, this mission does not work well in TFM which has 'all' the mods.
I know it sounds like a lot of work to run multiple versions of the game but I found it to be worth it and as you have a 1Tb drive you have loads of space (I am guessing) for messing around.
So, bottom line, Yes I think it likely that one of you modds is causing the issue. You say the lean versions also do not work? They have very little ground objects. I am surprised they are running slow. I would recommend a clean version of DBW for testing before messing with your video card settings as this game is not that demanding on the video card.
Hey Hamm, success! I did as you recommend here and it worked. I have just tried the "lean" U.S. version thus far. What I did was get rid of all those mods I had (new TFM) and only use the one that makes my screen wider, whatever that is called. I do have a couple of questions though, as usual. When you use the Generic Mod Enabler thing to remove and add mods, would getting rid of them that way cause your game to not work? And, when, if you have backups of the game on a external hard drive (and they work) and then move them onto an internal drive, would that create any problems you know of? I think that maybe I have had difficulties before when I moved the file but that may have just been me getting confused. Would Windows 8.1 have problems digesting all that? Anyway, with your advice I have your missions working. Thank you very much for your help and patience with one who is old and not too smart either.
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... in the case of very heavy missions you can also try to use texture compression (in OpenGL mode) to get more fps ...
In your conf.ini:
[Render_OpenGL]
TexQual=3
TexMipFilter=3
TexCompress=2
TexFlags.UseDither=0
TexFlags.UseAlpha=0
TexFlags.UseIndex=1
TexFlags.PolygonStipple=0
TexFlags.UseClampedSprites=1
TexFlags.DrawLandByTriangles=0
TexFlags.UseVertexArrays=1
TexFlags.DisableAPIExtensions=0
TexFlags.ARBMultitextureExt=1
TexFlags.TexEnvCombineExt=1
TexFlags.SecondaryColorExt=1
TexFlags.VertexArrayExt=1
TexFlags.ClipHintExt=1
TexFlags.UsePaletteExt=0
TexFlags.TexAnisotropicExt=1
TexFlags.TexCompressARBExt=1
....
HardwareShaders=1 ===> =1 means your are running in Open GL and perfect mode ... ;)
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Golly Hamm, you called me "Mr Holmes". And you haven't even seen me, with my lack of hair and other seventy-plus "attributes" that I am acquiring at an ever more alarming rate nowadays. Anyhow, thanks to you and Mick for your responses. I have used these forums most often to keep myself out of trouble (and assistance as I asked for here, of course). I mess something up and then have no clue on how to fix what I screw up. My friends who are still around are hell at the on/off switch, but little else. Kids all have families and not much time as expected. If you can believe it, they look to me for advice! You smart guys have really helped me out over the years. Thanks again to you fellers.
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Tried the P-51C mission and had no FPS issues.
Quad Core AMD 2.8
HD 5770
Win Xp
3 Gigs RAM
Me thinks effects=1 has an effect. :D