Special Aircraft Service
the SAS Hangar => The Lounge => Topic started by: Alex T. on March 26, 2012, 03:55:17 AM
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Hi guys, I have access to two P-51D Mustangs in real life and I would like to offer this opportunity to a modder who would like to do some justice to the P-51 that we have in the game: we had this half finished Mustang in the game for too long now and I would like to do this wonderful plane some justice.
What I can offer is all the technical information you need, plus pictures of details and obviously FM details. I can also do the same for the T-6 and Stearman, so if you're interested (no time wasters please), give me a shout.
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sorry to bump this, any takers? Could this post go in the wishlist maybe?
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well the mustang is, sort of "THE" American plane. (floppy dingus... :D)
the Jug has gotten some Love, the Mustangs Pit as well... but nobody dared to do, as you say, a "revamp" to correct various shortcomings and bugs.
The guys that do it, will have 50.000 people watching the progress... and bit ch about every misplaced rivet.
maybe it is too intimidating a task...
however - if you are near such planes, i guess i can say "feel free to post pix" as you stroll in and around these beasts. specially the more unknown corners and dark maintenance bays...
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Are they flying aircraft and if so how much have they been modded or upgraded since the 1940,s. A lot of the flying 51,s have been somewhat modified with the additions of modern systems management instrumentation and nav equipment, though some restorers try to house these things in original casings. Most of the mods would probably be related to the interior rather than exterior. Sometimes modifications from original are to meet FAA regs, Airworthiness Standards, AD,s and such. I have done some judging in the past at fly-ins and it is not often that you do see 100% original, they are usually missing things like first-aid kits and flare pistols and relief tubes etc. Just food for thought. I agree that you should post pics so those that do not have the opportunity to view these magnificent beast up close can do so. Another deviation that you see is paint types and sheen. Again obviously because of the durability of modern coating systems. Fabric control surfaces are usually done with Ceconite as opposed to Grade A cotton.
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well the mustang is, sort of "THE" American plane. (floppy dingus... :D)
the Jug has got some Love, the Mustangs Pit as well... but nobody dared to do, as you say, a "revamp" to correct various shortcomings and bugs.
The guys that do it, will have 50.000 people watching the progress... and bit ch about every misplaced rivet.
maybe it is too intimidating a task...
however - if you are near such planes, i guess i can say "feel free to post pix" as you stroll in and around these beasts. specially the mire unknown corners and dark maintenance bays...
at
what do you mean the jug has "some" love. in my opinion, the jug is better than the mustang. whats the point of having a super good plane if its armament cant scratch a 109 and it goes down after a few shots with a 20mm?
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I'd like to see the Mustang's exterior made a bit more accurate. In the "D" model, the canopy is wrong. when viewed from the front- head on- the "bubble" should be somewhat visible over the windshield framing. Our current model seems to be based on the old 1/48 scale Monogram kit, where the model makers jacked things around to make the windshield framing the highest point on the canopy (a common fault on most plastic mustang kits of the late 1950's- early 1960's). I'd also like to see the extra kink in the leading edge of the wing at the wing root of the earlier P51b's and P51a's made smaller and more like the real wing shape on these models.
Also, I'd love to see the razor back of the older P 47 Thunderbolts made sharper, and less thick and rounded.
I'm probably just being too picky- these planes look good enough from most angles, to most people, and these small details of contour and shape rarely show up in photographs, anyway.
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well the mustang is, sort of "THE" American plane. (floppy dingus... :D)
the Jug has got some Love, the Mustangs Pit as well... but nobody dared to do, as you say, a "revamp" to correct various shortcomings and bugs.
The guys that do it, will have 50.000 people watching the progress... and bit ch about every misplaced rivet.
maybe it is too intimidating a task...
however - if you are near such planes, i guess i can say "feel free to post pix" as you stroll in and around these beasts. specially the mire unknown corners and dark maintenance bays...
at
what do you mean the jug has "some" love. in my opinion, the jug is better than the mustang. whats the point of having a super good plane if its armament cant scratch a 109 and it goes down after a few shots with a 20mm?
Well 4 151/20's anyway, as is correct.
And if you cant knock down a 109 with The Dingus's guns then your a bad shot plain and simple.
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actually i have found the mustang to be a perfectly capable and enjoyable aircraft to fly, my tactic is to trim it with slight left rudder so that is doesn't snap roll at lower speeds, and you have to be gentle with it, otherwise it will snap rolls anyways.
Acceptable offensive maneuvers
Yo-yo both high an low
scissors
thatch weave
split S
also it is best to start with an altitude advantage, as you can zoom back up and only dive if the adversary is nearing the top of his climb, he'll have low energy and won't be able to follow, you can light him up without a care
Acceptable defensive maneuvers
snap roll (cut throttle pull back while kicking rudder, don't hold for more than 1 sec otherwise you'll enter a spin)
Dive(the mustang is pretty heavy, it can out-dive messerschmitts with ease, the fockewulf will require that you do not dive below a certain altitude)
zoom climb(gain some speed and then belt it to the heavens, that merlin will carry you higher faster than any German fighter)
if you are flying at a low speed, do not attempt to fight an aircraft at the same altitude as you or above you, you will snap roll as he maneuvers, only go for those below you and gain some speed, do not follow a fockewulf below 20,000ft unless you intend to take the fight below 6,000 these two zones are where the mustang excels, inbetween not so much.
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hmm i still like the jug better
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well the mustang is, sort of "THE" American plane. (floppy dingus... :D)
I'm tired of this aircraft bashing. If you want the word "Easy" banned, then aircraft bashing should be too
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This is a MUSTANG Topic.
The MUSTANG is the center of the Topic.
This is about the REMAKE of the MUSTANG.
I apologize for even mentioning any other planes.
because that could be Plain Plane Bashing, or discriminating.
Look, the Mustang can stay Fugly as is. All i wanted to give was some feedback on the MUSTANG TOPIC.
You know... be nice, supportive and offer a perspective.
That is why i put the "floppy dingus" in there... you surely remember that thread? And i put a smile behind, to be interpreted as light hearted humour gloss over my entire post.
The only thing in need for a serious bashing and banning are some heads around here.
Maybe i should make a first move and drag my sorry ass outta here.
Because i sure offend a lot of folks...
SO sorry. like... not.
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i saw the humour in it, and it was fine, imho, Hundertz.
let's move on with the topic at hand, gents, and leave the bashing comments for another time and place. ;)
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HZG, it was kind of my fault for bringing up the jug.
sorry!
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did you bash the Jug?
no! i committed the crime of saying something similar to
the spit is, kind of "THE" british fighter of WWII
next time, i shall just shut up. and let an offer go completely ignored, even if it is Bumped.
better to ignore and behave like a fucktard, rather than get the talk going, and accept said offer.
apologies again.
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relax hun!! these are just opinions, you offend no one and you have a sofisticated and refreshing sense of humour, here have a puff of my fag and relax mein brutter ;D ;D
(pooooooopppmmfffft!!) oops sorry :P :P SEMPER FI, CHEERS
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O MY GOD EDDIE PLEASE STOP ITS SO ANNOYING
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wow guys, from no answers to this! :-)
Anyway, I can post pictures if need be, but there definitely are some basic things that could be fixed:
1) landing gears: the 3d model of the legs is wrong, the torque links are not joined in the middle.
2) the tailwheel is all wrong: first of all the tailwheel itself 3d model doesn't swivel, second thing, the tailwheel lock is controlled by the stick. With the stick in any position except full forward, the tailwheel steers about six degrees either direction, plenty for taxiways and takeoffs and landings. Push the stick hard forward and you can feel it pull the locking pin out of the tailwheel mechanism allowing it to full swivel. With the stick back, the Mustang tailwheel is free to swivel.
3) the overall 3d model could be improved slightly: wing leading edge, overall size/shape is wrong (possibly based on wrong drawings), flaps are wrong, canopies are not correct (there should also be a D and K version of the canopies), there's no aerial, no rearview mirrors (optional both inside and outside),
4) the landing gear main doors should slowly, gently start to drop after the engine is off because of the hydraulic pressure dropping with the engine off. They come straight up when you turn the engine on.
5) there should be different versions of the props: hamilton standard cuffed, uncuffed, aeroproducts version and postwar paddle uncuffed.
Cockpit would benefit with a revamp and some animations (i.e. the canopy opening handle)
re. flight models, the machines we have are slightly modified, albeit being original: no armour protection, fake guns and ammo, no central tank/radio/battery. The rest is pretty much as it was (cockpit is stock conditions!), but the plane is quite lighter: we can take off with pilot + passenger at just 70% throttle.
There's a distinctive feature that should be there though: laminar flow wing is extremely efficient, but gives no pre-stall buffeting, this should be implemented.
I'll be happy to share the necessary info with any taker.
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anyway, just to prove that I mean business ;)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/35399_402742823030_658208030_4411647_5789929_n.jpg)
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AWESOME GIVE ME THAT STANG!!!!!!
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Hey cool pic, I would love to fly a real mustang ;D Even though I dont like it that much in IL2...
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AWESOME GIVE ME THAT STANG!!!!!!
funny, I thought you were a jug fan! :P
love that plane
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i know, but i'll take what i can get.
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Hey cool pic, I would love to fly a real mustang ;D Even though I dont like it that much in IL2...
and that's why I'm trying to look for help to fix it ;)
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the mustang is a timeless work of precision engineering, made from scratch, no plane resembled it in the skies. My dear departed uncle flewone in europe and the pacific and in the beginning of Korean war. He said that flying a mustang is like riding a tiger; it can be done but mistakes are deadly as the stang was spin-sensitive. The scmitt had a comparable performance and was pretty rugged, more so than a mustang.
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I forgot to mention that I can also contribute skinning it, I've done it before and I know what I'm doing with it.
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anyway, just to prove that I mean business ;)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/35399_402742823030_658208030_4411647_5789929_n.jpg)
That wouldn't happen to be the Stallion 51 at Kissamee in Orlando, would it? If, so, im down the street in tampa! :D
Also, the P-51 is WAYYY to slowwww ingame. the regular cruise speed was 400+ or something, which was its major advantage in WW2 (Which it doesn't have in game)
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That wouldn't happen to be the Stallion 51 at Kissamee in Orlando, would it? If, so, im down the street in tampa! :D
Also, the P-51 is WAYYY to slowwww ingame. the regular cruise speed was 400+ or something, which was its major advantage in WW2 (Which it doesn't have in game)
nope, but I've been to Stallion 51 when I visited the States and they do a marvelous job there :-)
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From an almost purely skinning point of view, there's only a couple little things I'd like to see changed (and wouldn't break every P-51 skin already made):
The wing pylons already have a spot on the skin, but the texture isn't used.
Completely redo the radios. They look horrible and bear almost no resemblance to the real radios.
Sharpen the tip of the VHF radio mast on the upper fuselage.
The plane sits too high on the landing gear. The bottom edge of the leg door should be about halfway between the center and edge of the wheel hub.
I don't know if I'd bother with the different models of canopy (it does need a little more bulge to it) and prop. They really aren't too noticeable and had virtually no effect on performance.
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All that picture is missing is a Kurfürst dropping in from the high 6, Mk108 at the ready...
;)
But I started the dingus thread so I guess its expected from me.
Honestly though I am for making the aircraft as accurate as possible.
Some interesting reading here:
http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aviation/p-51-cruise-speed-395-mph-tas-808.html
http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aviation/p-51d-mustang-top-speed-3205.html
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That's interisting. Makes sense, TBH I always expected the Stang to be faster in IL-2, no matter which mod pack.
It should fly like the worthy predecessor of the Sabre jets..not just another WWII fighter regarding speed.
Oh well, time to hit the deck.
T.
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yeah I feel that way too, it had a max speed of 437 o 440 depending on model at high altitude, in game I never got it past 330 at HA and that was in a 25 degree dive while chasing a schmitt
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http://www.mustangsmustangs.com/p-51/p51specs.shtml
call me a mustang hater...
(the B model is sexy)
call me biased...
call me an idiot...
"400+mph regular cruise"
"437 at high altitude"
you guys are talking floppy dingus.
Never have i encountered so much misinformation and biased opinions on one page.
(maybe CWMVs assertion of the mustang, but then the man is a 109 flyer, what do you expect...)
Conclusion:
The mustang is in dire need of an overhaul - both Graphically, AND in the minds of the young users.
http://www.pprune.org/tech-log/10669-ias-tas-formula.html
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if you ask me, the mustang was only good because there pilots were more skilled than the enemy.
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Hey I didn't say anything bad about it!
:D
I will say this though, there is a lot of mis information about the aircraft. I think people are more about the legend of the plane than the truth.
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you bashed that kite to death! if not typing about it, in your mind you were yelling at that beast to fly the way you wanted.
admit it!
admit it!
admit it!
no ifs buts or whens...
you were swearing all over the goddamn thing.
:D
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............
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ha! gotcha!
i KNEW it!
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the only problem I have with the stang is that it is the spin king, you just tap the stick back at low speed and you're careening nose over tail into oblivion.
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Remember, little to no indication of stall in this thing and it has the low speed performance of a brick.
This thing wasn't a turn fighter. It wasn't much of a fighter in the traditional sense at all. But it was fast, could fly far, and worked well when the odds were literally 1000 to one in its favor.
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the only problem I have with the stang is that it is the spin king, you just tap the stick back at low speed and you're careening nose over tail into oblivion.
Try Histomod. :D Sorry, couldn't resist. TBH the Histo Mustangs are also too slow IMHO. :)
But I don't have the guts to report this as well, after ca 20 zillion F-86 FM comments and pms to lebig. :'(
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Remember, little to no indication of stall in this thing and it has the low speed performance of a brick.
This thing wasn't a turn fighter. It wasn't much of a fighter in the traditional sense at all. But it was fast, could fly far, and worked well when the odds were literally 1000 to one in its favor.
I disagree completely
they appeared in december 1943 when it was found that P-47 and lightning just weren't up for the job
and at first it wasn't much better except that it could follow them all the way to Berlin, when Doolittle decided to make them spread out and attack aircraft that were either forming up, taking off, landing or just cruising, it tore up the Luftwaffe. and according to the pilots who flew it, it could turn inside both the BF-109 and FW-190, except for the 109G-10 and k which could fight on equal terms.
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is this about the mustang redone 3D wise or about opinions which was better?
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hey I'm just saying it could use quite a bit of FM changing as well as the 3d changing
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hey I'm just saying it could use quite a bit of FM changing as well as the 3d changing
Hi,
Please read all of this: https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,21158.0.html and report your observations there.
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okay, so... there is an FM section, where your problem of flying the plane can be adressed
the problem I have with the stang is that it is the spin king, you just tap the stick back at low speed and you're careening nose over tail into oblivion.
or... the famous floppy dingus topic, where the solutions to these problems have already been disc... bashed to death like beating a dead ho... mustang.
3D things i would like to see improved or addressed... very few, because i like how she is modeled overall...
the gun ports, all 3 of them made of something more representative than a few pixels on the skin (two on the early birds)
the leading edge "kank" difference between early and late wing
the landing light in the wing
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I would have posted on the dingus topic if it wasn't a few months old
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Dogfights- P-51 Mustang: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCGXPnYqks0
Dont like them fighting at high altitude? Ok..... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lW2nU4vRWM
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Remember, little to no indication of stall in this thing and it has the low speed performance of a brick.
This thing wasn't a turn fighter. It wasn't much of a fighter in the traditional sense at all. But it was fast, could fly far, and worked well when the odds were literally 1000 to one in its favor.
I disagree completely
they appeared in december 1943 when it was found that P-47 and lightning just weren't up for the job
and at first it wasn't much better except that it could follow them all the way to Berlin, when Doolittle decided to make them spread out and attack aircraft that were either forming up, taking off, landing or just cruising, it tore up the Luftwaffe. and according to the pilots who flew it, it could turn inside both the BF-109 and FW-190, except for the 109G-10 and k which could fight on equal terms.
You mean it appeared in December 1943, after the Luftwaffe had already been broken by the t-bolt/RAF.
But yes, it did very well in situations where they had complete numerical superiority and tactical advantage, and better trained pilots. Fly a bunch of bombers over as bait and knock them down as they come up, good tactic. Just doesn't say anything about the quality of the aircraft.
And as has been said before, pilots memories aren't worth much. Priller described being able to turn inside the spitfire in his Emil, but were not trying to make the spit turn worse are we?
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The real p51 was an energy fighter, think of her as a prop phantom. She was fast, deadly and very delicate, capable of unbelievable aerobatics if you had the altitude or energy for it, my uncle flew with bob hoover and yeager in europe and later with Shomo in the pacific, he considered the stang as a heavyweight that hit like a middle weight.
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The 51's didn't have a numerical or altitude advantage in Y-29 CWMV
The real p51 was an energy fighter, think of her as a prop phantom. She was fast, deadly and very delicate, capable of unbelievable aerobatics if you had the altitude or energy for it, my uncle flew with bob hoover and yeager in europe and later with Shomo in the pacific, he considered the stang as a heavyweight that hit like a middle weight.
And its not like that ingame :-[
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only over france where the thunderbolt and the RAF could reach, as well as over North Africa, but the point stands, those aircraft that defended Germany especially near Berlin or in central Germany would not have been so much as scratched by those escort fighters, Schweinfurt is my example, when the Mustang appeared it was still about 4 months before T-bolts with droptanks appeared over Germany and still, they couldn't carry out the shuttles that landed in Russia. And the Luftwaffe lost far more 'experten' to the mustang than they did thunderbolt. And for the record the mustang is my second favorite after the 109G6
We're really far off topic, now so let us return to it.
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They had wayyyyyy better pilots and coordination.
And it is precisly like that in game. With high e the stang is hard to beat. In my 109 I just get the suckers to come and try to fight me low and slow-then even in a g-6 its an easy kill.
The good stang jockies don't fall for it.
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The real p51 was an energy fighter, think of her as a prop phantom. She was fast, deadly and very delicate, capable of unbelievable aerobatics if you had the altitude or energy for it, my uncle flew with bob hoover and yeager in europe and later with Shomo in the pacific, he considered the stang as a heavyweight that hit like a middle weight.
OK...let's hit another "never flown anything yet know something round" (self-pun here)..
No disrespect..but I think that comparison is off...not only that the F-4s are twin-engined heavyweights very limited in their turn capabilities, but after all I've read and seen in videos, the P-51 is capable of very sharp, snappy maneuvres and also very agile-flown properly. I think this is what your uncle referred to. Just because both fighters are energy fighters does not mean they can be compared in their fighting capabilities.
Now IF your uncle said she was the prop Phantom-ok, respected. He surely knew way more.
But I hardly think he would say that.
F-4s are trucks, correct on the energy aspect...but I rather see the P-51 as some horse with an excellent thrust to weight ratio for a prop-fighter and would rather compare it to an F-104--lol--if at all. Sure the F-4 has wayyyy more power, but compared to other prop fighters the Merlin engined P-51 was a Ferrari. Hope you get my point, many birds come into my mindset, the P-51B/C/Ds are referred to as dogfighters and I rather think of an F-16 in comparison..lol..given the 30 years in between development.
This here was posted sometime ago at SAS..
http://www.keytlaw.com/f-4/f-22-pilots-comments-after-flying-an-f-4/
Cheers, Eddie. :)
PS: Your uncle flew with Bob Hoover and Yeager?? How cool is that?! :)
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The real p51 was an energy fighter, think of her as a prop phantom. She was fast, deadly and very delicate, capable of unbelievable aerobatics if you had the altitude or energy for it, my uncle flew with bob hoover and yeager in europe and later with Shomo in the pacific, he considered the stang as a heavyweight that hit like a middle weight.
OK...let's hit another "never flown anything yet know something round" (self-pun here)..
No disrespect..but I think that comparison is off...not only that the F-4s are twin-engined heavyweights very limited in their turn capabilities, but after all I've read and seen in videos, the P-51 is capable of very sharp, snappy maneuvres and also very agile-flown properly. I think this is what your uncle referred to. Just because both fighters are energy fighters does not mean they can be compared in their fighting capabilities.
Now IF your uncle said she was the prop Phantom-ok, respected. He surely knew way more.
But I hardly think he would say that.
F-4s are trucks, correct on the energy aspect...but I rather see the P-51 as some horse with an excellent thrust to weight ratio for a prop-fighter and would rather compare it to an F-104--lol--if at all. Sure the F-4 has wayyyy more power, but compared to other prop fighters the Merlin engined P-51 was a Ferrari. Hope you get my point, many birds come into my mindset, the P-51B/C/Ds are referred to as dogfighters and I rather think of an F-16 in comparison..lol..given the 30 years in between development.
This here was posted sometime ago at SAS..
http://www.keytlaw.com/f-4/f-22-pilots-comments-after-flying-an-f-4/
Cheers, Eddie. :)
PS: Your uncle flew with Bob Hoover and Yeager?? How cool is that?! :)
how to make yourself a phantom
step 1: buy a rocket booster
step 2: buy a brick
step 3: tie them together
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:D
PS:
Eddie: Again, if that statement comes from your uncle, I buy it. ;)
I cannot say anything from self-experience here..and the Mustang sucks at low speeds and high AOA.
Sorry for the heavy off-topic also, back on topic. :-[
Cheers
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(http://sportsgonesouth.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/10/fsu1.jpg)
something interesting.
(http://files.turbosquid.com/Preview/2010/12/05__08_06_00/WireframeIII.JPG6b654826-4d8c-4d28-b531-637414de0e55Larger.jpg)
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naked mustang (wolf whistle)!! Drop those hoes and show me more naked planes, you giving me an erection!!!!
After ogling the naked p51, Eddie shakes his pantleg and lights up a suspicious smelling fag, raises his pint and hollers: Yeeeeaaaaah!! Plane porn is better than sex!
SEMPER FI, Cheers Hun!!!
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jesus lord in heaven I was just scarred by that post.
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The real p51 was an energy fighter, think of her as a prop phantom. She was fast, deadly and very delicate, capable of unbelievable aerobatics if you had the altitude or energy for it, my uncle flew with bob hoover and yeager in europe and later with Shomo in the pacific, he considered the stang as a heavyweight that hit like a middle weight.
OK...let's hit another "never flown anything yet know something round" (self-pun here)..
No disrespect..but I think that comparison is off...not only that the F-4s are twin-engined heavyweights very limited in their turn capabilities, but after all I've read and seen in videos, the P-51 is capable of very sharp, snappy maneuvres and also very agile-flown properly. I think this is what your uncle referred to. Just because both fighters are energy fighters does not mean they can be compared in their fighting capabilities.
Now IF your uncle said she was the prop Phantom-ok, respected. He surely knew way more.
But I hardly think he would say that.
F-4s are trucks, correct on the energy aspect...but I rather see the P-51 as some horse with an excellent thrust to weight ratio for a prop-fighter and would rather compare it to an F-104--lol--if at all. Sure the F-4 has wayyyy more power, but compared to other prop fighters the Merlin engined P-51 was a Ferrari. Hope you get my point, many birds come into my mindset, the P-51B/C/Ds are referred to as dogfighters and I rather think of an F-16 in comparison..lol..given the 30 years in between development.
This here was posted sometime ago at SAS..
http://www.keytlaw.com/f-4/f-22-pilots-comments-after-flying-an-f-4/
Cheers, Eddie. :)
PS: Your uncle flew with Bob Hoover and Yeager?? How cool is that?! :)
how to make yourself a phantom
step 1: buy a rocket booster
step 2: buy a brick
step 3: tie them together
I suggest you google some and you can find blue angel and thunderbird f4s racking up gsnaked mustang (wolf whistle)!! Drop those hoes and show me more naked planes, you giving me an erection!!!!
After ogling the naked p51, Eddie shakes his pantleg and lights up a suspicious smelling fag, raises his pint and hollers: Yeeeeaaaaah!! Plane porn is better than sex!
SEMPER FI, Cheers Hun!!!
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"... and then emits one great and sour fart."
Ellie Phanton-Castle
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omgwhatdididonow!
eddiiieee!
here is for you, to get you all "normal" again.
i KNOW you appreciate this picture.
(http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/50271_245290859002_5262919_n.jpg)
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M-mum?!
Borris
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I jest. On the other hand, some of the lasses in Essex...
Francois
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...right, I take it nobody's interested then? :(
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(http://shadowdd.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/wire.png)
(http://farm8.static.flickr.com/7013/6811776957_bdf6a57f74.jpg)
(http://shadowdd.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/p-51_mustang_back-e1277488593844.png)
(http://shadowdd.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/clay.png)
(http://files.turbosquid.com/Preview/Content_2010_12_09__02_52_13/P51_wireframe_400x400.jpg32d2292f-bd77-4162-bd3a-3ef4cd0c55f9Larger.jpg)
sorry bout the offtopic...
i will refrain from talking about the subject at hand now.
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alex... who cares.
some ARE interested.
but this is the SAS - what do you expect.
a lot of opinion in a factual thread.
nothing you can do really, i am afraid.
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With the utmost respect, old boy, I was under the impression that P51s were done. They'd been subject to a lengthy project by Lt Wolf (a lot of time and effort went into them, I assure you) which covered most major variants, with a painstakingly researched FM. On the other hand, another project was also carried out on the P51s at the same time, by whom I forget for Ultra Pack, again, with much love and effort and research being put into it. There was quite a bit of debate over which FMs were more accurate, with both sides presenting well researched data that their aircraft emulated. At any rate, one or either set of P51s was incorporated into HSFX and UP, and presumably later, DBW as well. Therefore the set of P51s which can be flown with mod packs are have been heavily worked on and are finished. If you take issue with the FM, I assure you, the FMs were very well researched. I've never flown any aircraft, so I cannot comment from there, but I have done a lot of historical research and the sources used were gen. There was a lot of discussion over whether pilot's descriptions from the time and reminiscances were useful or not. (We're talking a few years ago now)
The original modders are probably unlikely to want to re-open what were finished aircraft, and current modders probably have plenty enough on thier plate to getting on with. The other thing is, writing an FM is very difficult and there aren't *that* many people who can do it. But like I said, these aircraft are considered finished, it's not like it was a frankenplane job, and it's not like the P51s were the original 1C jobbies either. So I hope that explains why there have been no takers.
At least the suggestion sparked some interesting debates.
Lord Frank Cholmondley-Featherstoneshaw
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well without even entering in the whole FM debate, the 3d models are very well far from finished. I listed a good portion of things that should be addressed.
I reckon it's a shame that such an important plane of WW2 is left half finished, it would be nice to bring it up to the standards of the latest FW190s or Bf109s.
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HundertzehnGustav, those 3D models might have lots of polys but they are very inaccurate. The 3D models in IL2 are actually much closer to reality.
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well without even entering in the whole FM debate, the 3d models are very well far from finished. I listed a good portion of things that should be addressed.
I reckon it's a shame that such an important plane of WW2 is left half finished, it would be nice to bring it up to the standards of the latest FW190s or Bf109s.
+1..but modding seems to be a bloddy time-consumptive job, FMs, pits, 3D models, skins...I can only say hats off to the community so far regarding what has been accomplished in modded IL-2 over the past years.
Bottom line..I rather say thanks and may any modder do whatever he (or she) pleases.
Good Luck, Alex T., and seriously, if you want to fly them from a different perspective (not judging here), try Histomod. And make sure to activate Freddy's Mustang pits. It's 4.09m, constantly in friendly dispute or disagreement ( :D ) with SAS modders, yet both sides cooperate.
http://histomodforum.forumactif.org/
Cheers
Tom, who loves IL-2 and talks too much...g' night.
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I'm not sure some of the things you mentioned are even possible, it sounds like a lot of complicated coding.
Ronald
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How do u mean Moggy?
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This Mod addresses some of your request i think :)
https://www.sas1946.com/main/index.php/topic,13259.0.html
Cheers Dakpilot
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Controling how the tail wheel locks with the stick: I don't think I've come across this. There is a button you can map for locking the tail wheel, maybe try and set it for when the stick is pushed far forward. The 3d modeling you mentioned is more of a japancat style in depth overhaul. As for different prop shapes, it's doable, but will make little difference when the engine's on.
All these things you've mentioned though, they're very small things, as I said, it's nit picking, and a lot of it's difficult to do - a lot of faff for very small changes. Yes, I suppose if you love the mustang enough, it's worth it, but keep in mind the limitations on what is, essentially, a very old game indeed. As I said, the original modders would probably consider the planes complete considering all the time and effort invested in them up till now. Indeed, I would imagine your calling the aircraft unfinished might not be taken particularly well. As for modders who didn't work on these, most of them have plenty enough to work on already. And there's the possibility too that they won't want to work on what was to all intents and purposes a finished mod.
It's a shame no one's taken you up on your offer so far, but never mind. When the time comes, if someone asks if anyone has an in depth knowledege of the Mustang, then I'm sure your intimate knowledge of the mustang will be greatly appreciated.
--edit--
I'm merely suggesting reasons why there have not been any takers so far on your offer, however, someone with more skills and experience will no doubt be able to explain for you better why or why not.
Chuck
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Controling how the tail wheel locks with the stick: I don't think I've come across this. There is a button you can map for locking the tail wheel, maybe try and set it for when the stick is pushed far forward.
This feature exists in the Fw190 pack.
From its readme :
3. Locking the rear wheel .
You now no longer have the option of locking the rear wheel using the usual IL2
key, but you will be able to lock/unlock it at will by simply moving the stick : If
you slightly pull the stick while taxiing the rear wheel will lock itself provided it is
on axis, and will unlock as soon as the stick goes back to neutral, this is very handy
when you take off because it will be easier to keep the plane in line, but be careful
not to use too much rudder on one side or the other one, because when the tail lifts
from the ground you may be very surprised
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Oh well, there you are then. Thanks, mate! I cn't say I'm very current with mods anymore really..
Jenks