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[Uufflakke]

... Whatever the real truth regarding the situation you so eloquently outlined....  I fear your post will awaken ....... (pause for sinister musical intro) .......

                                              ........    the "Luft-rivet Counters".

Be prepared to suffer countless pages of statistics, graphs, pilot notes, eye witness accounts and quotes from sources too numerous to name.

... It is just a game guys .. get a life ....

Yawn...

G;

Ha! Better say that to a deaf man. He is more willing to take that advice to heart than so many members in the combat flightsim world.
Each and every detail of a sim leads to endless discussions. Have a look for instance at the BOS/BOM forum.

Even your line '... It is just a game guys .. get a life ....' will lead to overheated replies.
Seriously.

FM, DM, Mods On/Off, Online Cheating, Vulching, Shooting Parachutes, Swastika On/Off, AI, P-51 Porked, FW-190 Bar, Historical Skins, SP/MP/Dynamic Campaigns, Realistic Settings, Clickable Cockpits, Luftwhiners, Rivet Counters und so weiter. I've seen it all since good old UbiZoo.
A never ending story in the universe of WWII armchair pilots. 

[SAS~Bombsaway]

Whatever happened to the good ol' days when the only real heated discussions were " NEVER mention modding on this site! " and the never ending battle of " Nothing past WWII and NO what if's "  LOL

[SAS~Gerax]

I love it that a lot of planes I fly stalls so easily ..
as this so often saved my ass in dogfights.   

[Dimlee]

I discovered a cheap and effective way to add realism to my WWI flying experience & improved my dog-fighting skills.....

Lit one of these and placed it about 6 feet away from my desk.....



I then dowsed myself in petrol and dead insects.....

Every time I lost a dog-fight I moved the candle 1 foot closer

Give it a go https://www.amazon.com/Klotz-Candle-Benol-Castor-Scent/dp/B01M2CQSU2/ref=pd_lpo_194_tr_t_3?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=6TTZW2C0VRT7GEXTXDPT

I find it does wonder's for the concentration 

Cheers

Alfie

When I was deeply involved in IL2 online some years ago... I used to "punish" myself by withdrawing from the game for 24 hours after being shot at one of my favourite servers. Unless I bailed out close to the base, then 2-3 hours. "Realism". 

If I becomes IL2-insane again and return to online multi-hours sessions, I'll consider your Klotz-Candle solution.
 

[Dimlee]

I wonder...
Since the first complain in the initial message was about AI behaviour... Why not to choose human adversaries instead? There are still several servers active (4.13 mostly).
And should one believes that his lovely plane is "historically-unrealistically" underrated, why not to try to compensate this unfairness (of game creators? of the Mother Nature?) with other tactics, with numerical superiority, with element of surprise, etc.

P-38 was my favourite bird in IL-2 since its first appearance and I always suspected that it could be modelled better (roll rate for example). Well, I used to live with that. Followed McGuire rules of engagement on PTO servers, flew high and avoided being outnumbered on ETO servers... And when I was outturned by smart FW-190A9 (so unrealistic, damned), I just saluted to the winner and learned the lesson...
Or may be it's just me. Or may be P-51 is really different? - I never flew it enough. But I did respect P-51s in my FW-190s and never considered it to be "easy" opponent. Hell, I still remember how the engine of my Me-262 was shot by P-51 at 700m or 800m distance. I knew that pilot - no, he was not AI  but just very good with his gyro sight.

Peace.

[max_thehitman]

I discovered a cheap and effective way to add realism to my WWI flying experience & improved my dog-fighting skills.....

Lit one of these and placed it about 6 feet away from my desk.....
https://s24.postimg.cc/b4akz2ysl/CASTOR81e_D4_DPp_MML_SX522.jpg

I then dowsed myself in petrol and dead insects.....

Every time I lost a dog-fight I moved the candle 1 foot closer

Give it a go https://www.amazon.com/Klotz-Candle-Benol-Castor-Scent/dp/B01M2CQSU2/ref=pd_lpo_194_tr_t_3?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=6TTZW2C0VRT7GEXTXDPT
I find it does wonder's for the concentration 

Cheers
Alfie

Here is a good tip for you to fly in the WW1 airplanes.
Use one of those cheap white-colored cotton-fiber air masks that goes over the nose and mouth as
you often see people wear these days in large cities with smog.
But on the inside part , place just a little smudge of very used motor oil and let the cotton
fibers soak it in.
When you put on the mask to fly in a WW1 airplane you will smell all that burned motor
oil and get the feeling of a WW1 veteran pilot.

Placing in front of your face a FAN  blowing wind in your face is optional ! 

[SAS~Storebror]

To be fair, I don't think that the IL-2 Pony habit of dropping a wing when your make-up brush touches the stick isn't too relaistic either.
Other than that: Lerche FTW!

for those who are unsure .. the answer is .. two.

The answers is always, generally and inevitably 42:

Whatever happened to the good ol' days when the only real heated discussions were " NEVER mention modding on this site! " and the never ending battle of " Nothing past WWII and NO what if's "  LOL

We've been talking about Neuro in the chat lately.
Doesn't come close but the tendency is the same

Best regards - Mike

[SAS~Bombsaway]

Sometimes, when we have silly season, I miss those days.

[dagger123456]

.....and for WW1 more realism, bring ur beat up lawnmower inside ur home and set up ur chair on top of it then start the engine. Hahahahahahaha.

[Captain Dawson]

I love it that a lot of planes I fly stalls so easily ..
as this so often saved my ass in dogfights.   

Mmm hmm, it is helpful for escaping, unless you are an American plane! You can hardly complete a reasonable turn at all without dropping a wing, and when your wing drops JUST A HAIR, the FM pretends there's no airflow over the controls surfaces at all and refuses you any control ability for several seconds! This happens WITH AND WITHOUT stalls and spins on.

To be fair, I don't think that the IL-2 Pony habit of dropping a wing when your make-up brush touches the stick isn't too relaistic either.

and the never ending battle of " Nothing past WWII and NO what if's "  LOL

Other than that: Lerche FTW!

Someone please tell me why a LERCHE (Never produced - no engine capable of sufficient power - never flew - never could) can fly so incredibly in IL-2, and yet a regular old P-51 (REAL LIFE PLANE) can not even handle decently and a P-51 AI can't even defend itself against older Bf-109 models? Do you see where I'm coming from here? And Go 229? (No such thing as Go 229 it was Ho 229) IT HAS NO VERTICAL STABILIZERS. It does not take a rocket scientist to realize that "Go-229" could not possibly fly perfectly as in IL-2. "There are wing planes now" you say. I don't think a B-2 Stealth Bomber, with all its advanced technology, could fly a knife-edge, do you? 

.....and for WW1 more realism, bring ur beat up lawnmower inside ur home and set up ur chair on top of it then start the engine. Hahahahahahaha.

Guys, seriously. This isn't just an issue with me or my equipment. I'm NOT a noob at flying. I shoot down Mc.202s in a dogfight in a Spit with DESTROYED ELEVATOR AND FLAP CONTROLS, and can defeat a A6M on ACE in a prolonged dogfight in a P-400! I have even flown a few planes in real life, and I can tell you that the worst of them doesn't wobble around feebly with the slightest control input as the P-51 here does!

All I am trying to say here is that SOME planes have OBVIOUS problems with realism effects, both human controlled and AI, and they are there REGARDLESS of the realism settings. I don't think it is "rivet counting" to say that some planes are quite obviously biased against, and all I want is to see if there is a solution.

[SAS~Storebror]

I have even flown a few planes in real life

This sounds interesting, may I ask which planes you flew, where, how often, for how long, business or private aviation, ...

Re "Lerche's incredible flight model": There's no real life data you could rely on, therefore judging the IL-2 Lerche flight model unrealistic is somewhat pointless. Talking about whether this thing would even be able to leave the ground would be a fine topic for a recreational chatter together with a beer or two, but that's it.

Re "AI P-51 loses against AI early 109": They don't in my tests.

Re "Go 229 / Ho 229": Both names are correct. And yes, the plane (during the design phase it saw) never reached a perfect flight behaviour.

Re "B-2 knife-edge": Yes, why not?

Re "Mc.202": I agree that the flight model feels "fishy" when comparing it to the 109.

Re "A6M vs. P-400": Agreed.

all I want is to see if there is a solution

Definitely no.
Not for technical reasons, but "a" solution would mean that all would have to agree upon it.
You never get there.
Experience tells (and threads like this one shows) that when you express your opinion of one flight model and ask for others to agree, you get back 50 other opinions and on page 2 latest, the whole debate goes south.
There's two things you can do:

• Pimp the flight models of your favourite planes so they suit your flying style better.
  This will become an endless job when you switch planes
• Take the long route: Grab all kind of available real life data, real life specs, test reports etc. and build a flight model upon it.
  This is tedious, even easy things take a considerable amount of time, e.g. getting reliable data about control surfaces and their location, the precise center of gravity and center of mass, mass distribution with different fuel loads etc.
  But beware: When you finally finished your task and put all historically reasonable data in, you might end up with a flight model that exactly behaves like the one you just complained about.

Best regards - Mike

[LuseKofte]

Have you ever been at BOS site and seen FM discussions there? And did you know they are totally forbidden in DCS forums?
Well they are , for good reasons. There are simply tremendously different parameters when it comes to peoples feelings of a FM.
1. Your hardware , your joystick might be sensitive and might not go well with FW 190 and Other responsive planes.
You are using a cheap Rudderpedal or twist handle for rudder , these do not go well with some planes, and better with others

2. Most people fly fingertip manoeuvring with their digital joystick and many software try to compensate for this. This will be experienced differently and sadly those paying for the expensive stuff will get a better experience.

In BOX series people flying 109 expect to have a walkover when it comes to fight russian planes, and they should in most cases being smart about it. If a LAGG wins a dogfight it would not get mentioned, the butthurt 109 pilot will try to forget this embarrassment. But if a Yak does the same they go straight to the forum and yell yberperformance. This is why any FM discussion is futile , there are just 90% butthurtness among them, the serious ones drown in these wannabe pilots butthurtism.
Best thing to do is finding historical documents , preferably done by Testpilots of captured planes and do a painfully slow test in all altitudes with correct amount of fuel and then present it. You will spend weeks doing this and you might get a FM guru to take the task if your work is done correctly. Or you might not