Special Aircraft Service

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: [1] 2 3   Go Down

Author Topic: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed  (Read 5722 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

yak

  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25
    • _
speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« on: March 18, 2015, 09:47:50 AM »

hi!
found major issue! may be i should post it for team daidalos.
but first what do you think?
in the game currently there is no aircraft that shows real speed on corresponding altitude.with real power plant rating and plane weight.
try p-40e for example. with allison 1710-39 rated at 1150 and take off weight 3700kg it should show 480km/h at sea level. and vmax of 580km/h at 4,5km altitude.
it fails in game!same for bf109 p-51 etc. same speed for any altitude..
currently im tweaking engines and planes. to get real values.but this is time consuming and should be tested each time.
some automation of horizontal flight mod would help a lot.instead of trimming all manually...
what do you think?does anyone aware of this problem?someone interested in solving?
Logged

SAS~Storebror

  • Editor
  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18142
  • Failure is not an option.
    • What goes around comes around, you'll see
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #1 on: March 18, 2015, 11:09:55 AM »

try p-40e for example. with allison 1710-39 rated at 1150 and take off weight 3700kg it should show 480km/h at sea level.
(...)
it fails in game!

Hear, hear...
Logged
You've got no one to follow, and no one will follow you. Ain't that a relief?

greybeard

  • Modder
  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1694
  • diligo veritatem
    • Old stuff about RB3D and a tiny "IL2 corner"
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2015, 03:44:26 AM »

in the game currently there is no aircraft that shows real speed on corresponding altitude.

I think you're speaking of speed shown either on so called "Speedbar" or on dashboard related gauge. Both are Indicated Air Speed; speed mentioned in references are True Air Speed.

Secondly, you should detail how you tested those speeds: the only way I know is to test in autopilot, which can't get more than 93% throttle, so top speed must be computed.

Besides, for aircraft having engine with multi-stage supercharger, the high blower must be on.
Logged
CPU: AMD Athlon 64 - RAM: 2GB DDR @ 201 MHz - MoBo: ASUSTeK Computer INC. A8N-SLI (Socket 939) - Vidcard: 1024MB NVIDIA GeForce 9400 GT (Club3D) - Screen: L1750SQ (1280x1024@75Hz) - Audio: Realtek AC'97 Audio.

yak

  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25
    • _
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2015, 02:15:05 PM »

actually Indicated Air Speed is somewhat higher than true. red digits in bottom left corner is true air speed i guess.
most of crafts have automatic supercharger.
current settings for p-40 are complete mess. they specified some brute force hack for engine just to make it flyable.
meanwhile i have some success in handling this. it is compressor related problem. type of compressor, altitudes, steps, multipliers should be defined to get specification speed for each aircraft.
for p-40 i get 480 at s.l. and 580 at 4-5km. and even 540 at 1,5km and 560 at 3km. but there is constant plateau up to ~800meters where there's no speed boost for some reason. and steeper compressor curvature does not handles this speed/alt. dependency plateau. or does someone knows how p-40 behaves up to 1km?
now i'm testing and adjusting it's climb to match 7,5minutes to 5km.
i do not dive deep in all that physical model,how it was coded.just basic parameters tweaking to get better flight simulation dynamics.
if i'll be able to get p-40 with it's real characteristics -i'll post buttons here to check. may be tomorrow or after.
if no-would ask team daidalos to dive deeper..
sorry for my english.
Logged

SAS~Storebror

  • Editor
  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18142
  • Failure is not an option.
    • What goes around comes around, you'll see
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2015, 12:17:54 AM »

actually Indicated Air Speed is somewhat higher than true.
What? No.
Above sea level (1cm is above), IAS is always lower than TAS.
This for instance is the speed curve of an aircraft climbing at constant IAS to FL260-280, then changes to climb at constant mach further on:


red digits in bottom left corner is true air speed i guess.
No, your guess is wrong.

most of crafts have automatic supercharger.
What? No.

current settings for p-40 are complete mess. they specified some brute force hack for engine just to make it flyable.
What? No.
Sounds like you're mistaking the fmd and emd parameters for precise resemblances of real life values?
Usual beginner mistake.

meanwhile i have some success in handling this.
(...)
for p-40 i get 480 at s.l. and 580 at 4-5km.
Do you ever read replies to your posts?
Can you see the screenshot above?
You claim the P-40E to be incapable of reaching 480km/h TAS @SL when the screenshot clearly shows that stock P-40E even reaches 496km/h there.
Go figure...

i do not dive deep in all that physical model
So what you're basically saying is:
You've got no clue, don't care for physics, don't read replies, don't know anything about IAS, TAS, the game's flight models, the user interface...
But all others are doing it wrong, you're the beholder of the truth and now you save the world from... yeah from what? From nice flight models ;)

Interesting.

Have fun convincing TD :D

Best regards - Mike
Logged
You've got no one to follow, and no one will follow you. Ain't that a relief?

yak

  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25
    • _
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2015, 04:54:04 AM »

think this is wrong tactics..anyway..
So what you're basically saying is:
We know about all that bad things under hood. allison 1710-39 rated at 1732,8hp to make p-40 at least flyable. and so on in same style.
please look at screenshot above just to meditate and relax a bit
we share your huge disappointment!
but please do not disturb us- solve it on your own and have fun...
or disturb team daidalos
 :D
Logged

SAS~Storebror

  • Editor
  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18142
  • Failure is not an option.
    • What goes around comes around, you'll see
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2015, 04:56:20 AM »

Read and understand:

There is nothing to solve.

You just don't understand it or you don't want to understand it. Neither we can help you out.

Best regards - Mike
Logged
You've got no one to follow, and no one will follow you. Ain't that a relief?

yak

  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25
    • _
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2015, 05:12:14 AM »

can you achieve 700km/h at 7km altitude flying p-51?
all this IAS and TAS conversions are real world relevant things. not digital! where all are same actually i bet. models are approximated.
or can you take a look at .emd allison specification?
who is wrong? 1710-39 has 1700hp! and max rpm 2600.
while real has 1150hp at 3000rpm
and so on...
Logged

SAS~Storebror

  • Editor
  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18142
  • Failure is not an option.
    • What goes around comes around, you'll see
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2015, 05:42:30 AM »

can you achieve 700km/h at 7km altitude flying p-51?
Yes.


all this IAS and TAS conversions are real world relevant things. not digital! where all are same actually i bet.
You absolutely refuse to understand.
See the image above.
704km/h TAS, ~470km/h IAS

This is relevant. Stop complaining things you just don't want to understand.

models are approximated.
Yes.

or can you take a look at .emd allison specification?
who is wrong? 1710-39 has 1700hp! and max rpm 2600.
while real has 1150hp at 3000rpm
Answered before already, start reading and stop complaining:
current settings for p-40 are complete mess. they specified some brute force hack for engine just to make it flyable.
What? No.
Sounds like you're mistaking the fmd and emd parameters for precise resemblances of real life values?
Usual beginner mistake.

Best regards - Mike
Logged
You've got no one to follow, and no one will follow you. Ain't that a relief?

yak

  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25
    • _
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2015, 07:31:19 AM »

you achieved that in a dive!...
ok ok i dig this stuff on IAS and TAS .TAS could be checked by pressing ctrl+f1

but old p-40 is hack. that made confusion to me!

current specs are like this:
p-40e
  Engine0Family Allison
  Engine0SubModel V-1710-39

[V-1710-39]
  HorsePowers 1600
  BoostFactor 1.083
  WEPBoostFactor 1.0001
  cAfterburner 0
  AfterburnerType 10
  CompressorSteps 1
  cCompressor 0
  cMix 1
  RPMMin 200
  RPMNom 2600
  RPMMax 2600
  RPMMaxAllowed 3320
  Reductor 0.50
  PropDiameter 3.36
  PropMass 150.0
  PropAnglerType 1
  PropAnglerSpeed 0.06
  PropAnglerMinParam 1000
  PropAnglerMaxParam 3000
  PropAnglerAfterburnerParam 3000
  PropPhiMin 22.0
  PropPhiMax 54.5
  PropAoA0 11.0
  CompressorPMax 1.52
  Voptimal 0.0
  CompressorAltitude0 4200.0
  CompressorMultiplier0 1.09
  CompressorRPMP0 600.0
  CompressorRPMPMax 3001.0
  CompressorMaxATARPM 1.236
  CompressorSpeedManifold 0.60
  CompressorRPM0 450
  CompressorATA0 0.70
  DisP0x 2750
  DisP0y 0
  ...

you can check this.

according to the main topic speed/alt. lets think everything is solved and fine!
Logged

SAS~Storebror

  • Editor
  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18142
  • Failure is not an option.
    • What goes around comes around, you'll see
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2015, 07:39:56 AM »

you achieved that in a dive!...
Wait... you call me a liar?
Logged
You've got no one to follow, and no one will follow you. Ain't that a relief?

yak

  • member
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25
    • _
Re: speed/altitude proper adjustement needed
« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2015, 09:25:25 AM »

that was a joke actually..
but wait you did that first!?))
look at specs..p-40 is mess..
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3   Go Up
 

Page created in 0.017 seconds with 26 queries.